(Is WoW Wiki going to consider the novels Canon now?)
(Is WoW Wiki going to consider the novels Canon now?)
Line 1,574: Line 1,574:
:I'd advise researching us a bit more. You will find that every novel and most novel characters have their own pages here, which link to other relevent pages. Novel characters appear on in-universe lists. We don't consider the novels not part of the Warcraft universe, we just tag any lore that turns up in one source only. It's a policy that was developed to keep track of RPG-only lore, and then branched into tagging other media.
:I'd advise researching us a bit more. You will find that every novel and most novel characters have their own pages here, which link to other relevent pages. Novel characters appear on in-universe lists. We don't consider the novels not part of the Warcraft universe, we just tag any lore that turns up in one source only. It's a policy that was developed to keep track of RPG-only lore, and then branched into tagging other media.
:NOTICE: Medivh has been part of the lore since the beginning, Khadgar was introduced in WCII, and Sylvanas in WCIII, so they aren't from novels by any means.--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 17:41, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
:NOTICE: Medivh has been part of the lore since the beginning, Khadgar was introduced in WCII, and Sylvanas in WCIII, so they aren't from novels by any means.--[[User:Ragestorm|<span style="border-bottom:1px dotted; cursor:help;" title="Admin">Ragestorm</span>]] <small>([[User talk:Ragestorm|talk]] &middot; [[Special:Contributions/Ragestorm|contr]])</small> 17:41, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
::He did say that "apart from" those characters, all of his favorite characters are from the novels. That would exclude the three he listed! {{User:Cynra/Sig}} 17:52, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Revision as of 17:52, September 28, 2007

WoWWiki:Warcraft pump/Please leave this line as it is thanks

Current Discussions

Please sign your messages!

Character view

Newbie question. My character is now looking down and I can't see what is in front of me. How do you change the character's view? Thanks for your help. --Dbair 15:17, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Left mouse button. Press and hold and move the mouse. Move into a desired position and release! You can also use right mouse, but you will turn your character with your view. Left just turns the view.
You can also use the Home-End keys I believe. --DanielCD 12:59, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
I think the camera angle also depends upon your chosen Interface Options (hit the Escape key to bring up the menu). I have also typed "/console reloadui" (without the quotes) to get out of what either was a buggy/stuck camera angle or was a problem with the thing between my keyboard and my chair. --Hot Rats 11:18, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Sometimes, when "/console reloadui" doesn't help, "/console gxrestart" will. // DarkRyder / Gossipgossipicon / Trainergossipicon // 20:24, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Change from Aldor to Scryer?

I did the quest "City of Light" (quest given by Kahdgar, npc in middle of Shattrath), and after that, clicked by mistake the quest "Allegiance with Aldor"... I haven't farmed any reputation or do any quests to the Aldor... Can I be a Scryer??? How???? Please help me!!!--Tsuruchi Hiro 01:00, 6 June 2007 (UTC) Hi!

Try killing Aldor in Shadowmoon vally?--SWM2448 01:06, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Killing the Aldor in Shadowmoon valley is the only option???—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tsuruchi Hiro (talkcontr).
If the Scryers in Shat are already unfriendly, making it impossible to do rep turn-ins, then it is all I can think of.--SWM2448 01:18, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Ok, Ty... I Will try it... Im at level 62, what is the level u recommend for it? 70?? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tsuruchi Hiro (talkcontr).
Since you accidentally signed up with the Aldor, you probably can't kill them (they should be friendly to you). What you need to do is go talk to Arcanist Adyria and get the quest Neutral 15 [65] Voren'thal's Visions from her. She's in the Lower City on the north side. You'll need to turn in 8 [Dampscale Basilisk Eye] to her. That will raise your Scyer rep by 250 (and lower Aldor by 275). After you turn in the first set, you can then do the repeatable quest Neutral 15 [65] More Basilisk Eyes which is the same quest (8 eyes for 250 rep). The basilisks in Terokkar Forest drop the eyes and range from level 62-64. It'll probably take about 16 turn-ins to get to neutral. Note that you can find the eyes on the Auction House so if you don't want to farm basilisk and got the cash, that might be a better alternative.
Once you reach Neutral 15 with the Scryers, you should be able to go back to Khadgar and pick the Allegiance to the Scryers quest. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 15:11, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Another note, for crafters who want patterns from both factions you can switch from one side to the other doing theis same method. I switched from Scryer exalted to Aldor and am now exalted with them. Took, iirc, 1370 [Dreadfang Venom Sac]. Mucke - Blameme 20:00, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Thank u SOOOOOO much!!!

Full of Neutrality

So I'm new here and this is my first attempt at expressing an idea and trying not to step on anyone's already posted toes or messing up articles. I was reading through the future race/expansion ideas and didn't know if I should post this there or not. I know there are a lot of people (myself included) that would love to see the Pandarens a playable race, and being strictly horde myself, would even like to see them wind up on the horde side. There is also a lot of information that would suggest it is entirely possible for them to make it into the game, but both horde and alliance have points against why the pandarens would join them. This got me thinking about future patches and possible races and one thought in particular jumped out in my mind: what if the pandarens were introduced in a future expansion as a playable race for BOTH factions? Granted because of PvP related interactions it would be confusing if they looked the same, but it could easily be made that there are visual differences between the two, not unlike blood elves and night elves for example. I'm sure if they lived among, say, the undead for long enough they would start to adopt habits that would reflect in their appearence, possibly becoming a little thinner, longer claws, red coat tinge, etc. as opposed to living with the humans that may, say, lead to a rounder fuzzier teddy-bear-esque look. Possibly slightly different racials (or even mirrored racials) would help make them even more seperate. Granted it is just a dream but not only would everyone be happy to be able to play them, but it would eliminate any issues with 'join this side or that' arguments and it would break the (I'm assuming) pattern of introducing one new race for each faction with expansions. Furthermore if the biggest issue with the Pandarens (From what I've gathered) is that they are so darned apathetic about the war between the factions, why wouldn't they be allowed, or feel free to join the side they choose, so long as they keep their own way of life intact? Anyways I didn't know if I should have put that in the future race ideas topic discussion or (not) so I hope it's okay here and I'm interested to see what your thoughts are. --Ndoki 04:51, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Feel free to leave it in the discussion there. And don't be so hesitant to step on toes (be bold!), unless the page specifically warns you to have a chat with other people before editing, so you can flesh out or shoot down your idea(s). :) --User:Sky2042/Sig 04:55, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks so much. :) --Ndoki 15:33, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
Paragraphs! Paragraphs! OWIE MY EYES! SharlinTalk / Did 10:51, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
This would make the lore a complete mess. Why have pandarens to the right, left and the centre at once? Kos 12:06, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
In addon, if such a thing will ever be released, leveling would be huge runaround and would take way too much time. For that reason too I think it'll be impossible.--Detank 06:14, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

22:42, 22 June 2007 (UTC)Droc 22:42, 22 June 2007 (UTC) I have already thought of mounts for pandarens. Kegs. Yes I said I think they should ride kegs log style. Like they run on it. Brilliant. Your solution to picking what side is great, but how about saying nay to bolth factions and having a neutral faction having Ethreal, Pandaren, Goblins, and such.

Yeah, but the problem with a neutral class is that they would have to either fight 2 factions, or no factions, so both would be obviously stupid.--???

Please sign what you write.
On topic, a solution to the who you can fight issue in PvP would be to have a neutral faction reputation with either Alliance or Horde. This could be determined by battleground fights. As neutral groups fight in the battle ground against Alliance or Horde the balance of who the neutral faction is aligned with could change. The more neutral faction groups that choose to fight Alliance the the lower the rep with Alliance is and the same for Horde. Members of the neutral faction could fight against Alliance or Horde, but if they fought, their rep with the enemy would decrease, but increase rep with their enemy (fight with Horde = +Alliance and -Horde rep). Neutrals would start as hostile with both Alliance and Horde, but could start doing quests of either when they build their rep to friendly with whichever.
Once a neutral was friendly with a faction, they could gain rep with quests as usual, but it would reduce their rep with the other faction. This way neutrals could try to sway their faction toward one side or the other, similar to the Aldor/Scryer thing, but with the rep with the other factions affecting how they interact in world PvP.
The implementation would be tough and neutral folks might tbe at war with themselves trying to sway them to one side or another.
Something to think about. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 11:24 AM PDT 9 July 2007

Exactly what I was thinking. Having these people be neutral would work if we did it in an aldor/scryer way, that way no one would or could complain about one side being too biased or overpowered, they choose what they want how they want it. --Droc 02:18, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

The reason we have different Languages in World PvP (horde can't understand Alliance and vice versa) is to stop abuse. Introducing a neutral race would mean that they would somehow be able to understand both horde and alliance. Not understanding what someone who ganks you is saying, not being able to abuse them and not being able to even have an intelligent conversation with them means one person COULD potentially get angry and go for revenge, but in the end it reduces the possibility of real world violence evolving from an online game. I like the idea of full neautrality, horde and alliance should be able to work together. I think the best way of introducing this would be with the introduction of the Lick King Expansion.

The scourge can be totally independent of the horde and the alliance. When unlocking a deathknight character, the player should fight for the scourge AGAINST the horde and the alliance where they could work together, against the scourge. much like within a sanctuary such as shattrath city, the horde and alliance would work together, but not be able to effectively communicate. meaning they would have to work in their own teams and respond to events happening in the other factions team, coming to their rescue or sacrificing them for their own gains. making WoW a more interactive and leadership based game than ever. -- - Wolfpaw, Druid @ Blackrock Alliance - Mistpaw, Shaman @ Blackrock Alliance - Marketing, Bank Alt @ Blackrock Alliance 00:55, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Umm... imaginative way the Death Knight might work, but highly speculative and probably completely wrong. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 4:28 PM PDT 13 Sep 2007

Macro Problems

I am not new to WoW nor am I new to programming, but i am new to making macros for WoW. I use a macro for my ranged attacks (I'm a MM specced hunter). The code is as follows:

/click PetActionButton1
/castsequence Auto Shot, Aimed Shot(Rank 6), Serpent Sting(Rank 7), Arcane Shot(Rank 6), Multi-Shot(Rank 4)

What I want to know is how can I get it to cycle through the rest after I'm one killing something i.e. go back to clicking the macro to make it cast auto shot. I frequently end up on me finishing a fight and starting a new one where I cast multi shot or sepent sting. Or how can I get it op cycle past one. Like if I were fighting two enemies, I wouldn't want to cast multi shot.

Try this
/click PetAttack
/cast Auto Shot
/castsequence reset=6/combat Aimed Shot(Rank 6), Serpent Sting(Rank 7), Arcane Shot(Rank 6), Multi-Shot(Rank 4)
Where the 6 is the refresh time on your Aimed shot --TranquilRage 10:39, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
Combat may not be a good reset if the hunter uses FD (which he damn well better). target may be a better choice TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 17:23, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Also, I can't seem to figure out how to degig this following macro.

/cast Feed Pet
/use 1 13
/cast  Mend Pet(Rank 5)

How can I get it to where every time i press the macro, it casts feed pet with that certain item AND heal my pet?

Thank you all very much. Gathorlo 00:24, 8 June 2007 (UTC) - Korialstasz Realm

You cannot cast more than one thing at a time, so it's either heal or feed, not both. TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 07:11, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
Try this
/cast [button:1] Feed Pet
/use [button:1] 1 13
/cast [button:2] Mend Pet(Rank 5)
Left mouse button Feeds, right mouse button Mends --TranquilRage 10:39, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you very much. That worked. Gathorlo 19:08, 8 June 2007 (UTC) - Korialstrasz Realm

EDIT: actually the macro for my ranged attacks doesnt work at all now. The error comes up and says the following:

Date: 2007-06-08 18:07:16 ID: 51 Error occured in: Global Count: 1 Message: ..\FrameXML\ChatFrame.lua line 1691:

  attempt to index local 'button' (a function value)


  [C]: ?
  ..\FrameXML\ChatFrame.lua:1691: value()
  ..\FrameXML\ChatFrame.lua:3382: ChatEdit_ParseText()
  ..\FrameXML\ChatFrame.lua:3092: ChatEdit_SendText()
  [C]: UseAction()
  ..\FrameXML\SecureTemplates.lua:218: SecureActionButton_OnClick()
  ..\FrameXML\ActionButton.lua:36: ActionButtonUp()
  [string "ACTIONBUTTON4"]:4:
     [string "ACTIONBUTTON4"]:1

I excluded the part that lists my addons. Thanks Gathorlo 22:03, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Leftover Quest Items

(I am new to WoWWiki, so apologies if this belongs somewhere else...)

There are quite a few quests that provide us with items to carry, and then fail to remove the items when the quest is over. I would like to see a page that lists these items and the quests they come from, so it is easy to look them up when it is suspected an item has become obsolete. Thank you.

--Telvanni 15:52, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Item pages already exist. It might be a good idea to just add notes to item pages as you discover they don't go away. TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 17:24, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
But that wasn't really an answer to his question Tek. This is easily solved by creating a category for it, it doesn't exist yet though. Might be a good idea for someone to look those things up and add them. // Patrigan | Talk/ Contr \\ 08:04, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
I agree, we need a junk quest items page. On a side note I hate your signature Patrigan, it is horrid to see when editting a page. SharlinTalk / Did 09:41, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
So would this be a single article or a category like Category:Junk Quest Items or Category:Leftover Quest Items? --Fandyllic (talk · contr)11:38 AM PDT 9 July 2007

Fire Mage Abuse

I am quite annoyed by the abuse that fire mages get....I am a fire mage and getting really annoyed by the magezines, the forums, the PvP mage guides,(which im not PvP...but still...)etc. That all say that if you're a fire mage, then you will basicly fail if you dont have ice block, improved counterspell, and all of the other arcane and ice talent spells.

well, I don't see why the forums talk about pyroblast, or blast wave, or the 10% chance stun in the FIRE talent line, or the 75% chance of fire spells not being interrupted. I think a lot of the forums for some reason were made by Ice mages. I wish more fire mages would talk about things in the forums. --Rabidmoncy 21:14, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

  • So do it. I don't know squat about mages, or I'd help. Add in sections where you think they need to be mentioning the other alternatives. --Azaram 09:05, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
Well my mage is nearly all fire, 2 points in Arcane and 5 so far in Frost, the last two will be improved frost nova. Nothing can out DPS a fire mage, its laughable how hard my mage hits. I rarely use Frost Nova as I can take the one or two hits anything non-elite will give me as it doesn't survive for 3 hits.
Ice Mages == EASY MODE. Its basically the sissy style of play. You have ice block and rely on it because you can't manage your opponents. Its used mostly by PvP and lack luster mages.
Arcane + Fire is great if you want to be a 3 minute mage (PoM to cast an instant Pyro is awesome) and I may covert that way, not sure if I want to give up Dragon's Breath though. SharlinTalk / Did 09:39, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
Now, now, both specs have their advantages and disadvantages. Certainly fire mages have oustanding DPS, and frost mages have much better survivability. But saying that ice mages can't manage their opponents is ignorant and rude. On the contrary, some of the best mages I've ever met are ice mages. In addition, I've had many warriors tell me they much prefer having ice mages in their group for instancing because of their increased survivability and their slowing effects. If they do pull aggro (slightly less likely, given their lower DPS), they're less likely to get hit, as the mob will be walking very slowly towards them, and even if the mob does reach them before the tank gets it back, they can ice block to give them even more time.
I've played both specs, leveling to 60 as fire and respeccing to frost at the talent review. I'll probably switch to hybrid with focus in fire soon to take advantage of my Spellfire gear. Both are very fun to play. One of my favorite things to do when I am bored is to try to solo higher level instances, a feat which was much, much harder as a fire mage. I'll miss that, but I'll also enjoy sending my opponents to firey hell so fast they don't even cover the distance to me. --Mikaka 23:47, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
10/48/3 is the prefered raid spec. Most raid mobs are immnue to slowing effects. As for it being ignorant and rude, the last person I want in my raid some easy mode ice mage who thinks his spec will keep him from getting killed. Too many of them are just that. Instances and Raids do not follow the same rules and they just don't seem to get it. SharlinTalk / Did 11:33, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
That's a little presumptuous. Pzychotix (talk · contr) 11:56, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
What the build or the experience of having played with too many of them? Its an observation from play, some builds are just refused from raids anymore because they can indicate the wrong mindset/playstyle from what is required for raiding SharlinTalk / Did 13:51, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm a 10/48/3 mage, and I also must say that I would not allow a frost mage to go raiding with me. Frost mages simply fall short on DPS...the survivability options are essentially useless, because a good mage should never draw aggro in a raid. If somebody wants to spec frost, that's fine, but they need to stick to PvP. Putts 23:03, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm full frost right now (0/0/61) to get every bit of damage I can out of it, was sitting at 10/0/51 for a while till they added the damage boost to Arctic Winds and with that much in Frost I opted to just take everything from there as I did not think I would get much impact from another tree.
I agree you should never take hits but I'm not usually the one that pulls aggro and as a frost mage I love how long Frost Nova can hold things for someone to take better control of the situation. Add Cold Snap / Imp Blizzard and you get some pretty nice options for CC beyond a single sheep. It's very mana efficient and when I'm soloing allows for burst DPS through FN/FB and Ice Lance to clear things quick.
I'm willing to look at options but haven't been able to cypher out everything in Fire, I see Arcane to Clearcasting and Elemental Precision from Frost easy enough but what exactly is this raiding spec? --Casey37 22:50, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Playing as fire mage is a lot faster than as ice........people just dont want to admit that fire mages are one of the games strongest force of a something you would call "fire lover" but what would you say?Fire mages rule!!!Qerka 17:04, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
Fire has its strong suits, but so does Frost. As Arcane/Frost I kept up with and/or surpassed all of my guild's Fire mages, and as Fire I enjoy the same domination. Not everyone enjoys the playstyle of Fire, for quite a while I certainly didn't, and Frost does tend towards superior threat reduction, slightly cheaper mana costs, and survivability at the cost of some damage. Calling 10/48/3 the "only" raiding spec is simple naivete - a good mage realizes that all specs have their place in differing situations, and can adapt summarily, something you often see among the mages of Nihilum, Death and Taxes, etc. what with changing specs as to fit the situation. (Also, I don't think I've ever heard of 'abuse' of only Fire mages - in fact, many mages tend to bash on every spec that isn't theirs for some reason, something that leads to much frustration and confusion.) Velrynne 09:16, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't know a ton about mages (one of the few classes I haven't really played), but alot of the abuse given to fire mages is based on what were the high level dungeons before Burning Crusade came out. With dungeons such as UBRS (or LBRS, I forget), Blackwing Lair, and Molten Core the DPS of fire mages was greatly reduced by many fire-resistant mobs. However with the advent of Naxxramas and completely new BC content some of the balance has shifted back toward fire mages. Arcane mages are the ones who get no love as far as I can tell. Someone should stand up for them. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 1:11 PM PDT 9 July 2006
Ok. so here we go. My first Toon was an arcane specced mage. Still is arcane spec. Simply put, I find them rather mana efficient, as well as having a decent DPS. This however, may have something to do that along with the talents and everything else, I have actually geared my mage toward halfway melee. I am not saying he is god. All I am saying, is i find that i can tear through gnomer, and manage 2-3 even con mobs. Clearcasting state and arcane missiles, with the sheild and everything... i just manaburn them down while i am swinging my sword. throw a few arcane explosions in there, and I have saved the party.
We have a Fire Mage on everyone of our Kara runs...doesn't cause any problems at all. In fact they are only one of two that come close to me on dps. --Mucke->Blameme 03:52, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
Ice Block and Improved Counterspell are really mostly important to PVP mages (along with goodies like Ice Barrier). If you don't PVP, fire mages are superior in straight up DPS (in my experience). However, in arena PVP, nowadays, focus fire is so intense that without Ice Block, you will simply die as a fire mage. Improved Counterspell is nice for locking down opposing players while focus firing someone down. I mean, it may mean nothing to you that the top arena teams have pretty much only frost mages, but if you can do better than they can as fire, show everyone they were wrong. =) --krakatoan 20:22, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Warcraft Astronomy


Here's an interesting pic of the sky from the Illidan encounter.

That's right... you're looking at Azeroth!

It seems like Azeroth and Draenor are a lot closer than we thought... close enough that Draenor could be (or rather, was) a moon of Azeroth, or vice-versa. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tyrsenus (talkcontr).

Really? Not fan-made? WOAH!--SWM2448 22:42, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

No, not moons of each other. That I'm certain of. I personally suspect this is just a doodad thrown in by the designers, especially if it is only noticeable during the Illidan encounter. --User:Sky2042/Sig 05:08, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
Think about it, though. The Draenei hijacked part of Tempest Keep and FLEW it to Azeroth. That means there is a definite physical distance between the two that can be crossed with a vehicle. Perhaps it is like space travel... IconSmall Orc Male1336 14:29, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
The Exodar did not fly. That I am also certain of. ;) Iirc, it bent space and time to get where it is today. --User:Sky2042/Sig 14:56, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
Hokay. Outland is in the Twisting Nether. Azeroth is in the Great Dark. The Great Dark and the Twisting Nether can overlap via portals or tears between dimensions, but they are not the same space/dimension. Draenor used to be in the Great Dark, but after it went nutty and imploded, the leftover chunks of planet got sucked into the Twisting Nether and are now Outland. If you can see Azeroth during the Illidan encounter, the best explanation would probably be that you're looking through a hole in the Twisting Nether at Azeroth in the Great Dark. Aphelian 07:28, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I think the Exodar could once fly like Naxx and other necropolises, but it is vague in that subject. Maybe the image is an illution or through a portal?--SWM2448 16:57, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
Nice sreenshot man. I added it to the Trivia section of the Black Temple -- Dyna18 10:47, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Response: Regarding the image of The Globe! There are already globe maps of Azeroth officially released, they do not have the Kalimdor and the Eastern Kingdoms like you see on the in-game map, you catually see Kalimdor is much shorter from top to bottom than the Eastern Kingdoms as portrayed by the in-game map, but it is also much broader than Eastern kingdom in the blizzard official Azeroth globe than it is shown on the in-game map that has both continents roughly the same height and shape.

1. Remember that the in game map is designed for you to see your way around the in-game world and may not be the most accurate description of the world, just like the areas you cover in-game do not accurately show all the features of that area as they would be described in lore or portrayed in a film, the game acts more like a summary of the areas rather than the actual rendition.

2. Remember that the in-game map is the map from the perspective of the in-game character, this is the known map according to the humna alliance (as far the humans knowledge of the world goes) and the Orcish horde ( as far as the Orcs knowledge of the world goes) they're the same because these guys have exchanged blows so many times, and you as an adventurer get your maps from your faction as such. The elves, tauren, dwarves are unlikely to put all their secret locations there.

3. The proof of this is the many large areas we know exist in the warcraft universe but are not even visible on the map, 3 popular ones are Northrend, Pandera and Undermine

  • NOTE : If you look closely you CAN see Northrend in the position it is supposed to be at according to WoTLK expansion.

4. The global map, 3-D rendition of Azeroth you see on the warcraft logo after the Cinematics and on the forums, the globe rotates, if you look at it carefully you will actually see what blizzard has mapped out as official complete world of Azeroth, it's small to the eye, but a big version can be seen if you watch the first cinematic, the end logo you see the world rotating... some notable features are how HUGE northrend is, the continent is bigger than Kalimdor and the Eastern Kingdoms... Eastern kingdoms land mass is very long, but rather narrow, and Kalimdor is much shorter on the globe rendition than in game, but much broader than the eastern kindgoms. Teldrassils is a tiny dot, far more reaslitic thatn the massive Island the in-game map paints it as, makes you think that purple teleporter in Rut'theran village actually teleports you into the tree, shrinking your size or it's more like Avianna's zone as described in the War of the Ancients. You also notice other bigger islands, in fact many, one of these could be the Panderan home land, another house undermine... then others part of the Naga etc..

Sorry I only meant to be brief but I thought it best to point out that if you're gonna start doing globe renditions of Azeroth, use the blizzard official one as the in-game map is not intended to be the full picture. (Springer07 22:44, 13 June 2007 (UTC))

Well, despite the discurson about the globe, is easy to understand the view of Azaroth on the Black Temple, by reading the history of Nobundo, the "Unbroken"

"Large chunks had been ripped from the desert floor and were inexplicably floating high in the air. And portions of the sky itself looked almost like windows to... something. It seemed as if Nobundo could glimpse other worlds in those windows, some distant, some seemingly nearby"

Azeroth, can be not at the same physicl space as Outlands, but even it, is weak in Outlands, just like the flux of magic runing freely into the sky, nothing have a strong bond to put the things how they should be, even the sky.... Outlands is now just like a game with a lot of errors, and missing parts, then, u can see some places that should not be see. Just like Azeroth :P

Actually there is alot of overlap between the Twisting Nether and the Great Dark... There are plenty of paragraphs that state that worlds exist in the Twisting Nether, including Azeroth. While other sentences state that they float around the great dark. The two "planes" apparently overlap, and from what I can tell one represents a more physical plane, and the other one more metaphysical, and a healthy world exists in both. When Draenor blew up, it became more closely alligned to the highly morphic Twisting Nether than the Great Dark, it became sorta "detached" from the physical realm (best I can figure), thus why it doesn't follow normal physics mechanics. I.E. if it had been thrown further into Great Dark rather than Twisting Nether, it would have lacked the gravity to support life, and the explosion probably would have wiped out all life, as it would if say Earth blew up in the same way. However the biggest problem with Great Dark and Twisting Nether scholars argue how it actually functions, so there are alternative theories as well.
As a side note IIRC, one source mentions that Draenor may have had its own version of the Emerald Dream at one time, but its believed it was probably wiped out when the world exploded.Baggins 17:23, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
It could just be that Illidan sensed this coming and opened a portal to Azeroth before the fight. Thus meaning he dose flee when defeated. So he could open a portal and shut Upinto a portal I mean he is good at it if we all remeber the last Night elf mission from Frozen Throne. So he could Leap through the portal En-Flight.

Oh and just to stop the question of "Then were is he now" Somthing could go wrong or he's smoking on Deathwings Hookah under Mount Hyjal. -Agamemmnon 23:04

I cant see these islands and stuff in the cinematic you speak of. Can you post a screedshot and circle them or something? Cormundo 20:38, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Game master

How can i be a game master? --—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kapteeni40 (talkcontr).

You need to apply for a job at Blizzard. --GRYPHONtc 15:34, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
They have HQs in Austin and San Franciso I think, you may want to check around there.
See the official site. news item on 8/30 says they are interviewing in Austin at GDC coming up. Also there is the jobs page for other times. --Dga 16:02, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Hunter's armor

Ok i know that this a real noob question ..But here it comes..i have a hunter and am a lil confused between Hit rating, critical strike and attack power on my gear. So could someone give me an idea what is best as a hunter? PLZ --Myhunter 18:05, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

All of the above. Hit rating boosts your chance to hit, crit increases chance of getting a crit (double damage hit), AP increases your damage. TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 18:41, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
Focus on Agility, then Stamina. When gemming later armor sets stick with +Agility items SharlinTalk / Did 09:04, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
Actually AP will benefit you more than agility. Agility is great but if you are looking at 2 items, one with 10 agi and the other with 20 AP you will get more raw damage from the AP. So for hunter the stat hierarchy (as far as damage is concerned) is AP-> agi-> crit-> hit. That said, don't neglect stam. It's not as important for Hunters but for raiding or heroics having plenty of HP for random bolts and aoe helps tons. --Mucke->Blameme 06:13, 17 July 2007 (UTC)
I'm afraid this isn't true for all hunters. It depends a lot on your talent build. Especially the talents that either give you +10% AP (marksmanship) or +15% agility (survival) make a big impact on which stat is best for you. Rougly when looking at items you can say that 2 AP equals 1 agility equals 1 crit rating. So it depends on your build if you should go for agility and crit rating, or go for attack power.
As for hit rating, try to aim for +7% hit chance.... once you got that, more won't help much against avoiding any more misses.
-- Dyna18 10:56, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Racial wowwiki descriptions and the Origin of the Races

After reading the wowwiki lore pages, I noticed that very little of the speculation or opinionated statements were actually in line with the official descriptions of the races. I was a bit surprised because Chris Metzen wrote those description I was told at BlizzCon 2005 and they are used as the framework for the lore and culture of each race expressed in the game, the books and (I presume) that will be expressed in the films. If you read each of the descriptions, the personality trait and general psychology frame of the culture that is stated in those description are adhered to almost to the letter, the dwarves are portrayed as stoic, the forsaken vengeful, the Blood Elves focused on more magical energy & reaching their beloved Prince.

One that particularly caught my attention was the interesting origin of the races article, no mention was made there for e.g. that Night Elves were the first to awaken in the warcraft universe, which is the official statement on the race, and while the possible origin from Trolls is an interesting read, the theory is given more attention than the more likely one of that race originating from Elune. If I didn't know more of WoW lore I'd be convinced that Night Elves came from Trolls after reading that article. May I request that the at least the official descriptions of the races be presented, or in the case of that particular race, a lovely flow-chart diagram showing the Origin from Elune & Cenarius should also be presented with regards to the Night Elves, that way it doesn't seem the speculation holds more weight or detracts from the official description but is regarded for what it is intended to be, an interesting rumour.

Also maybe mention things like the Trolls having the first known empire in WoW doesn't mean that they were the first race, that's like saying because the Sumerians had the first known empire in the world, that they were the first race of man, or saying that the Romans were the first nation becaause they had the biggest empire that covered the world. I myself have often speculated how Blizzard would write the earlier histories of the races, Trolls, Dwarves, Elves, Tauren are the ancient races of warcraft, the official lore says the Elves were the first to awaken, but then we do have the Trolls build the first Empire, were the Elves by nature preservationists?, keepers of nature like Cenarius, perfectionists, with their gaze starwards but not at the expense of abandoning the natural world? We are told that they are intrinsically linked with the well of eternity, and their lore has them originating from it in the heart of the world, but we know they arose to conquer the Trolls, how and why though?

Was it because they were completely disgusted by the increasingly savage, cruel rituals of sacrifice and cannabalism that the trolls had sunk to in their quest for more powers that kickstarted the Elves into doing something about it? Or did the Trolls start attacking the them because they grew jealous of the Elves because of their beauty, or art/architecture or their wealth or civilization? Was there some previous serious grieviance or a petty one that sparked the conflict? Did the Qiraji play a part in it even though this precedes the war of the Sands Or was it when the Elves started manipulating the energies of the well they grew more ambitious begining to be seduced by the power they started to learn to wield? Well the Well of Eternity has always been a part of them, but that doesn't mean they had always known how to manipulate it, or alternatively using it may have come natural, but it wasn't until Azshara and her sect of highbourne rose to power did the really impressive stuff begin, was it that impressive stuff that attracted the trolls and led to the confrontation? or did the deeper use of the well by Azshara and her sorcerors, make them more ambitious or was it Azshara's dislike for perfection that caused it or an earlier monarch...

Lots of interesting speculation arises enough by adhering to the official facts about the race, and it would be nice to see some of them in the articles about that race and some of the other races, but at the moment, the speculation is too heavy on the rumour.

--Springer07 21:09, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Wow... That is the most intellegent thing I have ever read by a new person. You are asking for there to be more rumors in the race pages?--SWM2448 00:16, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

The request is for the race page descriptions to be more in line with the official statement of the races, origin of the races document was particularly highlighted because speculation contrarty to the official statement seemed more prominent than speculation in line with the official statement, I am merely asking that speculation in line with official statement should be given more credence and went ahead to do a bit of speculation myself...i'd like for e.g. to see a nice flow chart diagram showing night elf connection with Elune & Cenarius alongside the one showing a possible origin from Trolls, so its a bit more balanced. Then I'd like to see the other racial descriptions more accurately portray or embody the heart of their official racial statement. Anyway, I must say all the wowwiki documents are very well written. Good job guys. By the way, plausible speculation is fun to read (Springer07 08:02, 14 June 2007 (UTC))

If there is another theory that needs to go on a page, add it.--SWM2448 20:25, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

I have to agree with Sandwichman (SWM), that if you think something should be added, you should add it. I will start off the changes you suggest from what I've read, but you should edit it to fit what you want. See Origin of the Races#Elf and Troll Origins --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 1:25 PM PDT 9 July 2007
If anything it makes the content more interesting when speculating! =)  Nuurdientalk&contr 21:22, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Game photos

I want to put some pictures from the game into WOWWIKI but I haven't learned how can I take a photo. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kapteeni40 (talkcontr).

If you press the "Print Screen" button on your keyboard, it will create a .JPG in the Screenshots folder in your World of Warcraft directory (if you are using Windows). You will have to find a way to crop this image in an image editing program like Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro, however, before uploading to the Wiki. Review WoWWiki:Image_guidelines for more details on how images should look before being uploaded. -- TUSVA ~ T | C 13:47, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
Also, keep in mind that a screenshot will capture your UI in addition to everything else unless you hide it first (Alt+Z). Putts 23:05, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
If you're only going to resize screenshots you're probably better off with a lightweight program like irfanview. Use the heavier programs if you want to apply all sorts of effects etc. Bonez0r 01:08, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
On a Mac, you should be able to use Cmd-Shift-3 (or Apple-Shift-3) to take a screenshot and it should appear on your desktop. You may want to open and re-save it as JPG or PNG in Preview, though. I forget what the default format is, but I think it's PDF. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 1:05 PM PDT 23 July 2007

Travelling with pets

Yep, another noob question (aren't they all?), sorry: I've travelled by hippogryph exactly once, twice if the return trip counts separately, and since then have tamed an elder nightsaber which has become indispensable to me. I now have a quest requiring me to leave the island again. Will my cat automatically come with me if I travel by hippogryph? And if not, same question for other modes of transportation? Thanks

--Austinlwyman4 12:04, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

All tamed pets will disappear when you ride on a taxi such as the hippogryph, and then will reappear when you land. Worry not, your pet is safe and can only be lost if you manually decide to abandon him or not feed him routinely! -- TUSVA ~ T | C 13:48, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
Pets now also temporarily disappear when you mount your personal mount, and reappear when you dismount. This has made a lot of people very angry, and is generally regarded as a bad move. --Azaram 03:31, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Actually, as a warlock, I really appreciate this change. With ground mounts it doesn't matter so much, but on a flying mount, what are you supposed to about your demon running along below you aggroing everything? Automatic dismissal and reappearance means no lost soul shards every time I want to fly. --Darlezi 20:50, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Why would people get upset about their pets disappearing and reappearing when mounting/dismounting? Its seems like that would be a good thing for the pet owner. Or is it the victims that are upset? I could see that it would be annoying to have a hunter fly over you (how often are you looking up?), dismount, send the pet in while falling, and then start plonking away when you land. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 15:16, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Although I love how my pet is automatically summoned and dismissed, I have observed some minor annoyances. I doubt these are making people "very angry," however, since I'm seeing a lot more supporters instead. The first relates to hunters attempting to Feed Pet or Mend Pet. Before the change, I can Feed Pet, mount up and ride to my next destination, say a farming spot, and by the time I reach that farming spot, maybe the effects of Feed Pet will have finished and I can send my pet into battle right away. With the change, the pet will be dismissed, and although it will still have the Feed Pet effect, the effect won't actually be ticking while I am mounted, so when I reach my destination and dismount, I will have to wait for the Feed Pet to finish before I can send my pet in. The same applies to Mend Pet. Secondly, and please note I do not play a warlock, if a warlock has an Imp active with Blood Pact, is at full health, then mounts and loses the effect of Blood Pact (since the Imp will be dismissed), upon dismount the warlock will not be at full health when (s)he regains Blood Pact (when the Imp is re-summoned). Thirdly, I prefer the look of my pet active running alongside my mount because I have a Winterspring Frostsaber mount and a Winterspring Frostsaber pet, and they look so sweet together. ^_^ DaAznSaN 17:57, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
If you doubt that it made a lot of people mad, you ought to look at the forums. I like having the pet I chose running alongside me... and as a hunter, I lose the benefit of spirit link, so if I mount and ride while hurt, I don't heal much. I can understand doing it for flying mounts, but it's nothing but irritating to lose it while riding.

My warlock, when she outdistanced her pet while walking, would get a 'free' soul shard back, so she wasn't losing anything. She isn't high enough level to have a mount, but I'm pretty sure there weren't any lost soul shards involved in that, either, like when taking a taxi... --Azaram 08:37, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps this is something that Blizzard could create a toggle for. You could set the toggle on/off for pets despawning when you get on a personal mount. That way you're pet would stay active for buffs/feed pet/whatever. I imagine you would leave it alone for taxis since you will also outdistance the pet on one of those - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 16:03, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
I believe they started working on the pets and mounts issue just before the release of the Expansion. The returned soul shard was an attempt to make flight fairer for Warlocks. One small exploit developed because of this: Warlocks could use the Abyss Shard to summon their voidwalker and then take a flight; a soul shard was created and returned to the Warlock even though one hadn't technically been used before. (Not a spectacular exploit, but probably not what the game developers intended.) That is not possible now that the pets disappear instead of being dismissed.--Erisio 23:22, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
The whole "vanishing pets" was a response to the issue of warlock pets getting desummoned whilst the warlock was on a flying transport of any description. Since lock pets take 10 secs to summon, on PVP servers, if the warlock wanted to fly into a combat-heavy zone they would be petless and at a disadvantage for the summoning time. This did not affect hunters since Summon Pet is instant.

the servers

Ok this is going to be a long story. Me and a few friends used to play FFXI, but ulitmatly got bored of it and decided to switch to WOW. after all of us downloaded the free trials we decided we would meet up in the american server of "arygos". well 10 days have gone past and i like the game and i went out and bought my self a copy... only thing i have not told you yet is that im the only one of those friends who lives in england... everyone else lives in america. and now its telling me i can only accses EU servers. Is there anyway i can get a charecter onto an american server even if i have the EU copy of the game?

--Harrypottersalterego 07:56, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

The game client you use is the same no matter what region you live in. However! They come with different "" (Warcraft Text File) files which point it to specific sets of servers. (US or EU, essentially.) To play on the American servers, follow these simple steps:
1. Open your World of Warcraft folder. (Typically "C:\Program Files\World of Warcraft\")
2. Open the file named "" in Notepad, WordPad, or any standard text-editing program. The contents of your file should look like this:
set realmlist
3. Change the above to look like this:
set realmlist
4. Save the file and close it. You are now ready to log in to the US servers (provided you have a US account).
Bear something in mind, HPAE. I'm not sure if the Euro codes for registering an account work on the US servers. Either way, if you used your code to register a Euro account, you can't use that code again. You'll also need to use the US site to manage your US account. These accounts -- Euro and US -- are on two seperate servers under two different company subsidiaries (Blizzard Euro and Blizzard US). Sorry to sound like a jerk, but I just want to make sure you understand this in whole. Accounts cannot be transferred from one region of servers to another.
And in case anyone's It is not against any policies of any kind to play on the Euro servers if you're playing in the US or the US servers if you're playing in Europe. There is no way to exploit this and're just lagging yourself (generally slightly). Blizzard prefers you play on the closest server, but they don't outright care either way. The proof of this is not one "foreign" account holder has been penalized for playing "out of their terrotiry".
Hope this helps! ~ Doc Lithius (U)(T)(C) 17:02, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Burning Crusade Slim/Full Download

I'm just curious as to what the difference is for each of these downloads. Why is one of them smaller then the other in file size wise. Thanks --Cldmani 14:44, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

If you're talking about like the small 1.5, 2.0MB, etc. thats usually Blizzard fixing in-game errors, now the big ones like the latest one, are adding onto the game or making a big change in the game..If you mean something else then, I don't know.Thehollow 15:09, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
well, the full download of burning crusade is 2.04 gb while the slim download is only 1.18 gb. I just wanna know the difference in the two.

Leatherworking Bag?

Alright. Dumb question here, but I need to know... Is there some kind of bag made exclusively to hold leather, threads, and your skinning knife? Or even just leather? I've been told one such bag exists in Expansion01, but there's no info on this object here or anywhere I've checked... ~ Doc Lithius (U)(T)(C) 17:11, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Well I am no expert, thats why i go on database sites..I'm not thinking there is such a bag, because they would surely broadcast the new "thing".Thehollow 04:48, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
There isn't. There is also no Cloth bag. Aleandar 06:59, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Battlegroup Merge: Cataclysm and Frenzy

Just a heads-up for those of you unaware... The battlegroups of Cataclysm and Frenzy are merging after this next maintainence downtime (scheduled for Tuesday, June 18th). More information can be found here. ~ Doc Lithius (U)(T)(C) 19:07, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

I've added the new merged Battlegroup template, Retaliation and updated all the pages that were using them. I didn't have time to update the Battlegroup pages and the pages linked to them though. I'll get to that later in the week if no one else does first. --Roach 03:46, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Auto Dismounting causing issues.

Ok, I have a question about the "Autodismount" but I'm not sure it belongs here..

I'm currently developing the "Outfitter" addon, I monitor the if a toon is mounted or not.

My issue is that if a player casts an instant spell when mounted I get the "Unit_Spell_Sent", "Unit_Spell_Start", "Unit_Spell_Succeeded" event's. But if I try to change my Trinket based on this I get a "Cannot do that during Combat" error, if I check for "InCombat" (Using the PlayerFrame.InCombat or watching for the "Unit_Regen_Disabled" event or even doing the InCombatLockDown() ect.) all return that I'm currenrtly NOT in combat.

Is there a call/event mising? or is there another call that I can use to test for combat?

I've searched the site and I'm running out of ideas.


--Zanoroy 04:18, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Well CTMOD has the same problem, if your involuntarily dismounted it will not recognize the vent. The reason that that is a problem is that ctmod has options to block pet bars while mounted. Best of luck SharlinTalk / Did 10:05, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Fresh Install

Okay here is the question. Gonna install a fresh one. Which patch to install after installing WoW + TBC?

Step 1) Install WoW (the box is the new edition, the one from the discount) Step 2) Install TBC Step 3) Which patches now? 1.12 then 2.1.0 full? or 2.1.0 full directly?

Thanks! --Gangren 10:42, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

Latest patch is 2.1.2, so plan the shortest patch path accordingly. TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 15:37, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Use a patch mirror, filefront is a good one. But I did not think you had to install original WOW first. SharlinTalk / Did 16:23, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
Try installing BC without having installed WoW, if that works without problems, let your game automatically download the patch(es) it needs. If you see a patch(1) to patch(2) where patch(2) is before the current patch, then you are, indeed, better off downloading the patch from or filefront. --Warscout

Shaman duel tactics/leveling/equipment

I'm kind of an in-betweener for WoW. I started maybe half a year ago, I've tried many things over that time. I've been known to be a kind of a char hopper, because I've used two/three months of that time to play every class and race in the game to try to catch a good option for me, and because when I thought I was settling down on a BE rogue I got him to lvl 22 and got bored (that was my main. I'd never had a char that high of a level before.). Well, now I'm determined I've found my sweet spot, a shaman, and I've FINALLY gotten him to level 23, over my last 'main.' But here's the thing--I'm a full-enhancement shaman, and I've found I suck at dueling and generally 1v1 combat, though I'm good in group combat. I nearly got beat by a druid four levels under me, and my good friend (a shaman who was two levels under me) beat him HARD with tons more HP than I'd had at the end. He seems to do a lot of jumping and spinning, but I still can't figure out what he's doing better than me. Generally I try to get up close, starting off with maybe some totems and a fire shock, then doing earth shocks whenever the cooldown wears off... what am I doing wrong?

On a different note, the same friend that beat the guy harder than me had better armor, and had equal/better stats than me on everything except Spirit. Considering I never use Lightning Bolts (enhancement, remember?), this is not a good thing. I need to get my stamina up, STAT--a warlock, yeah a WARLOCK in my last group had more health than me. I like to do instances a lot, so I've done WC ten or twenty times and have gotten three pieces of the Fang set... but apparantly that's not gonna cut it. What do I have to do to get more stamina-enhancing armor? I'm not going to use Spirit much.

Lastly, I have about 5 hours of play time a day in WoW, and I've found that the best way to use this is by doing instances. However, everyone around me levels ten times quicker than me! Is there a better way to gain experience, or do I just suck at that too?


I edited your question so it is easier to read and does not utterly obliterate our tables. Thank you --Ithar 00:08, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Enhancement Shaman suffer in PvP (dueling) and that has been acknowledged by Blizzard but they also said they have no fix. That being said, enhancement Shamans don't see much progression in DPS until they get their Wind Totems and the Windfury weapon buff. The next jump is level 40 where they get dual wield and the Storm Strike talent. Your also stuck in leather armor till 40 as well which doesn't help mitigate melee damage very much.
Most likely your problem in dueling is that you don't stay in melee range. All the running and jumping is simply being done to keep the melee class from hitting them, most likely trying to use frost, fire, or earth, shocks over and over. Don't worry about it. Dueling is for fun.
As for leveling speed, instances suck. The only time you want to do an instance is if you have a bunch of quests in their or just gotta have an item from one. The fastest way to level hands down is to do the quests appropriate for your level and gear. There are lots of free leveling guides on the net, try one. You will probably see that your wasting time in zones either too hard for you. SharlinTalk / Did 09:03, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
About the warlock having more HP than you do, that's not unusual. Warlocks use lifetap and drain life for mana, and tend to stack tons of stamina stuff. As one forum poster's signature says, 'My mana bar is green'. (BTW, everybody please sign your posts with four tildes...) --Azaram 03:17, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
My main is currently a lvl 47 pure enhancement shaman. When I read the start of your post I thought, this is me, becuase I jumped around all the classes and races before I settled on my shammy. First, I wanted to enourage you to stick with it. It is a somewhat hard and complex class to play, but you can really lay out some damage especially in pve. I don't do much PvP but in PvE I can consistently(and have always been able to) bring down mobs 4 levels above me, solo 2-3 mobs at my level, and in groups I am usually have the highest dps. So here's some tips: first make sure you have invested your talents wisely - read up on the best talent builds; conc. on armor that gives strength, stam, intellect, and agility (I try to go for all but prioritize strength); always train all you spells and learn what they do and in which situations u should use each one; and go for the weapon with the highest dps you can. Aim to get dual wield and windfury talents as soon as u can as well as stormstrike. You will be amazed at the difference and the power boost you get - and the tornado effect is so cool! When fighting cloth wearers close them down and melee them as soon as u can, if they are casting spells, wait till they have almost cast it and then hit earth shock - this disrupts the cast and delays the time before they can cast it again. Fire shock is good on rogues becuase it adds a DOT so they cant vanish. Frost shock is good on fleeing oponents so u can get back im melee range. Use ur totems wisely - they are the shammy's strength but also very mana hungry. Watch how ur friend does it. He must be doing something different. OR ask him to watch u and give u some tips. Most of all good luck and stick with it!

Thanks, everyone, but I have the answer. First of all, I don't think I had enough experience in shamans. I've also begun using a spell that I never really used before, but now practically worship... It's a little thing I call PURGE! A guildie of mine reccomended it to me. Now I kill warlocks easy, mages easier, and Paladins like they're grey-levels. I love PvP, and I find it easy now. It was probably just a lack of experience with shamans. Flurry helps a lot too. @ the guy above me, I have no intention to stop playing my Shaman. I've tried every other class except priest, and shaman is by far my favorite.
@ Sharlin--Bad at PvP? I don't think so. I love to kill Allies, and I pretty much dominate other classes now. Instances, noted. Leveling guides... I have the WoW Master Guide (Vol. 2). I'm trying to move on. I just can't find the entrance to the wetlands XD
@ Azaram--Demon Skin. Warlock+Purge+Tremor Totem=Dead Warlock.
@ Ithar--thanks. I still don't know how to sign my stuff XD
To sign, either type four tildes (shift and the key to the left of the number 1) or click on the signature button at the top of the edit window (second from the right, looks like a cursive scribble. Demon Skin isn't what I was talking about... that just restores a small amount of health, it doesn't give extra. I know warlocks with more HP than I have in my bear gear (not in bear form, just the high-stamina gear). --Azaram 04:40, 26 September 2007 (UTC)


What items should you get in early game and late game? Also, what heroes should you get in ap? I really don't want to be called a noob. = (


--Darigaaz the Igniter 00:00, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

All of your questions can be answered here
And for future reference, this site is for World of Warcraft, not Warcraft 3. --Ithar 00:05, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Wrong! It is for any and all Warcrafts, with a focus on WoW. --User:Sky2042/Sig 07:14, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Druid Talents...

I dont exactly know what talent tree is really best for Druid. Im a 30 druid that is all feral except for 5 points in restoration (furor). Also, what are the most useful feral talents, if im going to do that at all... The way I figure it is that if i wanted to heal more id be priest, and if i wanted to spell more id be mage...

thx!!! --Byrondude 00:55, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Generally, feral druids are easier to level than resto druids. I've never played a balance druid, so I can't really comment on that spec. However, as to the "best" talent tree, it really depends on how you're planning to use the character in groups and instances, as all specs have different styles for soloing. If you want to tank, go feral, in which case good talents would be those that increase your damage, and thus your threat, or your armor. You could also keep a set of dps gear for cat form, when soloing or dpsing. --Darlezi 21:00, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

With a Druid I would suggest staying in ONE Tree till you complete it. Your going to weaken yourself pre-50th if you diversify too much SharlinTalk / Did 09:04, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Balance is a bit slow compared to feral for a while until you start collecting your +damage gear then it picks up nicely. If you stick to single/pair mobs then its like playing a mage in plate. There is no real AoE other than hurricane once a minute. Also, if you need to heal you have a big mana pool and +damage is frequently +heal also. --Dga 22:15, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Silver portrait ring on reputation cap

I once came across a lvl 60 player who had a silver ring round his character portrait.... like the rare spawn monsters but without the dragon wings.

I asked how he came to have this and he said he had capped reputation with Undercity, Orgrimmar, Thunder Bluff and The Dark Spear Trolls

I am now lvl 70, exalted (and have capped the extra 1000 reputation points beyond this) for all 4 cities and Silvermoon but have no silver dragon ring round my character portrait.

Can anyone tell me what else I need to do please?

Many thanks

--Zorch 20:29, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

No idea, never seen this myself -- Dyna18 11:02, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Doomkin or Tree?

WElll i have been moonkin for a while now, decent gear bout 700 damage,... i was wondering on some advice if its worth being it when i rlly cant get many upgrades in my leather gear and people in groups and raids are idiots and dont let me take cloth damage stuff... should i just go resto ? --Thelugster 02:35, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Look at it this way, do you want to be a healer? If that is not your primary wish then switching trees isn't going to improve the game for you, it certainly won't make groups more likely to let you have cloth items.
I have found quite a bit of good +damage items in TBC that fit the druid well. You might investigate the leather working patters available for leather workers only as a source of end game gear. Some of the epic level equipment from them is very nice. SharlinTalk / Did 09:07, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

You need to download the add on which allows u to put an elite ring around your portrait i think there r three u can choose from the gold 1 the silver and a custon 1 and i also think if u twinked with it a bit u wud be able to make u own personal 1 but im not sure there

ycnt u spll ot wrds?

Still not the right question. try again

Is a demonology warlock a good match 4 any speciality paladin

--Tweakzy 12:49, 25 June 2007 (UTC) My mate who is a lvl 70 paladin said of of the only classes that has ever come close to beating him was a demonology warlock do you reckon this is true? I know that they dont have good armour but they can get good health i seen a lvl 70 warlock who had over 15,00 health. The reason im asking this is becuz the first character i made was an orc warlock im now lvl 43 and my speciality is demonology but after i get my felguard im goin to put the rest of me tp's in destruction because you get an awsum spell called shadowburn which has heaps of trainable ranks and its an instant spell sure u need a soul shard but considerin all the soul bags u get u usually have tons of them at use. So what does every1 reckon about my question about "is a demonology warlock a good match against a pali. Every1 feel free to answer i dun really care wat u say i just want other peoples opinions about it neways im off cya

First off your friend is just bragging. Paladins, regardless of spec, are still bound by the fact that person behind the character determines most of the outcome. Unless one spec is just so suited to undo spec the match should come down a little luck and who uses their cooldowns the best.
As far as a demonology warlock being a good match, well your pet isn't your most fearsome weapon. For the most part, to plate users, pets are an annoyance. If they concentrate on killing your pet first you probably will win. SharlinTalk / Did 15:45, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

u've got a good point there but by puttin ur tp ins demonology u also get good health not just good pets so by puttin ur points in there u'll last loga which wud make u a good match right?

soz this is 4 the other question 4 the other post above this

Model viewer.

Someone refered the site to me but how do I download it?--SWM2448 21:09, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

There are a lot of clicks to get to the download. Downloads from menu >> WoW Model Viewer >> WoW Model Viewer 0.5.09 >> Download. --GRYPHONtc 21:17, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks. :) --SWM2448 22:22, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

+hit rating - how much is needed, where's the cap

I tried to read myself through wowwiki and different forums, but I can't find a particular part of information:

How much +hit is good for my feral cat, where is the cap?

I know that depends on level differences between me and the opponent (PvE mostly) and +feral combat gear.

Nearly anything of the following considerations can be wrong, as I'm not very sure of the formulas.

I'm putting in the sources of these information. (external links because I posted this in, too)
To hit can only be used to counter the base chance to miss (5% for one-hand users without any off-hand weapon, 9% for two-handers and 24% for dualwielders)

I think I heard somewhere that feral cats are "one-handed" (even when carrying 2h staves) (Can't find the source)

So I assume against a mob of the same level I have a standard 5% chance to miss.
Chance to Hit
A player's chance to miss in PVE is also greatly affected by difference in mobs' defense and the player's attack rating.
If the monster's defense is 1 to 10 points greater than your weapon skill, you suffer 0.1% chance to miss per point.
If the difference is more than 10, the penalty is doubled to 0.2% per point

So, talking about a "standard" lvl73 mob as found in most instances (supposed defense rating 365).

I read the above as "penalty is doubled" for all points, not just the ones above 10 difference.

So: The chance to miss (5%) is affected by ( 365-350 ) * 0.2% = 3.0% more misses.

Should be 8% total.
+15.8 Hit Rating = +1% hit chance at 70.

So 8% would mean you need 124 +hit rating.

The maximum level seen is iirc 75 - so 375 def, meaning 5% more misses, meaning +158 hit.

With Feral Combat Gear:
It takes [..] 3.9 points of Weapon Skill Rating at level 70, to increase your actual Weapon Skill by 1.

So, when equipped with Clefthoof Hide Leggings (+18, Quest "Showdown") you get additions +4 Weapon Skill.
That gives you 365 - (350+4) = 11 difference. Doh, still *0.2.

11 * 0.2% = 1.5% meaning you need +103 hit.

Let's grind exalted with Cenarion and Lower City: Adding Earthwarden (+24) and Shapeshifter's Signet (+20) with the +18 Leggings give additional 15 Def rating.

Leaving the Lvl73 mob at "our" level with 5% standard miss, so +79hit gear is needed.

There are also some gloves from a Netherstorm quest (Flesh Handler's Gauntlets), but there are much better gloves when looking to, so I'll leave that +18 fcs out.

And the Shattrath Leggins give +22, meaning you can get +16 Def instead of +15, coming to +77 hit gear.
As the Clefthoof Hide Leggings give +17 hit rating, I'd take those, having the extra +4 feral combat cause 15 less +hit rating :)
To hit can only be used to counter the base chance to miss (5% for one-hand users without any off-hand weapon, 9% for two-handers and 24% for dualwielders)

ONLY... Strange word in the quoted text above...
Does this mean I need a maximum of +79 hit rating (without +feral combat), as I can't counter increased chance to miss?...

Seems unlikely to me.


For PvE (with mobs up to lvl73), you need:

  • +79 hit (with the 3 +feral combat items)
  • +124 hit rating (without the +feral combat items)
  • +158 hit rating would be a cap against lvl75 mobs (without items)

So, does this seem right? Did I take a wrong way somewhere? What do you suspect?

--Dieck 09:46, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Impressive. I have seen the 8% number bandied about a lot on the forums regarding the percentage increase needed to hit level 73s SharlinTalk / Did 10:43, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

HAP, AEP, and Tank points

Does anyone have the point based conversion values for all classes (other than the straight values) Rating comes close, but it varies per class, Formulas:Item Values comes close, but it still varies based on talent spec obviously. AEP Works fair enough for rogues, HAP works ok for hunters. but is there a similar system for warrior tanks / druids / mages / priests?  - CJ talk / cont  12:07, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I'd like this too, if someone comes up with it... --Azaram 10:05, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Reusable quest items

hey, i recently heard of Dartol's Rod of Transformation and went out and got it in like 30min. I was just wondering if there are any other quest items like this that have a use that can be used anywhere and that have unlimited charges. they can either be like the rod where you can turn it in for quest or when you finish a quest, or just a quest reward. this does not mean trinkets or other equippable gear with a use.

Bluuh, Commander of the Band of the Red Hand (Muradin)

There are a few other items I have seen like they turn you into a freaking ugly ogre, or a bat or such. But I have no idea at this moment how people acquire of these items. *heheheh what evil can i do tonight in this raid turn the main tank into a chicken!?!?* lol. got a little carried off there, But i think it might be an event item or collector edition item, or maybe even a quest that I've been dieing to find. Just ask around your cities and you'll find the answer.

Windjungj talk / contr 08:01, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

The bat one was a Hallow's End wand, most likely. They were originally permanent, but now time out after a week or two (I forget). A shame, they were fun... --Azaram 08:09, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
The Enchanted Moonstalker Cloak from Quest:A Lost Master, can be used once. Abandon the quest, take the quest again collect the mats and get another cloak. A lot more trouble than Dartol's rod but it is stealth for a bit. --Dga 16:26, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
The Gordok Ogre Suit is a tailoring or leatherworking pattern which lasts for 10 minutes once you use it, then it disintegrates and you have to make a new one. It is Dire Maul north and needs a material from inside to make one suit. An NPC in the instance can also make the suit, if you give him basically double mats. --Dga 16:26, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
Had to do one more. Noggenfogger Elixir from Quest:The Thirsty Goblin. Once you do his quest chain, he sells the Elixirs to you anytime you want some. --Dga 16:28, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Spore Bat Appreciation Day

Okay, so... I was wandering around my favorite NSFW anthropomorphic animal art gallery earlier and it's come to my attention that it's Spore Bat Appreciation Day. At least over there it is. Does anyone know what on earth this is all about and if it's a worldwide thing, or just localized to this art site? I didn't see anything in the Official WoW Forums or on the site, so I'm guessing that this art site is just doing a random spore bat appreciation day...but I figured I'd ask here. If it's not something celebrated everywhere, might I suggest we start it as a new trend? (Despite the fact spore bats are [bleep] useless as pets, I mean.)

P.S.: Yes. Yes I am. "Am what?" If you didn't ask, this doesn't apply to you.  ;3 ~ Doc Lithius (U)(T)(C) 09:31, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Sure, sporebats are fine.--SWM2448 14:50, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Lol, maybe they have a day for every animal haha. but I think it is just their holiday =x W i n d j u n g j talk / contr 07:40, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Someone likes furaffinity. Damn furries. TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 19:01, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Best WoW weapon

What I want to know is what the BEST weapon in all of WoW is. It's not really going to be an outright decision but more of an opinion. Once all DPS, stats, eqips, uses, etc. are taken into account, what is the best one? Really any weapon given will do, but if there is a list of some sort of each best weapon of each kind (i.e. the best dagger, the best 1H sword) then that woudl be appreciated. I really want to know becasue my fellow guildioes and I are always arguing which is the best: going into AtlasLoot and findign soemthing 1337 and someone topping it and then inspecting awesome palyers and linking them. I want this argument to be resolved. Thanks Gathorlo 05:10, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Martin Thunder. --Azaram 10:07, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

I want to be able to get it dude .That's stupid tgart you would just post some GM weapon. Post something that I could actually obtain after getting kyed or working for days and days at getting. Gathorlo 15:04, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Not my fault you asked an incoherent question. You asked 'best weapon'. One that instantly kills everything within 30 yards is best to me... --Azaram 03:51, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
azaram you shouldn't mind him =/ he is just probably another person in this game that takes things too seriously... don't take it personally lol. (What if players could actually get that item?) W i n d j u n g j talk / contr 06:02, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't take it personally. Thought it was funny. Heh. Would be nice, it'd be funny as hell to wipe out a 40 man turtle in AV and listen to them scream. --Azaram 02:02, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Well it would depend on what kind of weapon you want and such. Like do you want to call an item leet cause it has good bonuses or its DPS? And what kind of weapon cause as we all know not all classes can use all weapons =/ And what level are you that would be able to determine IF we could get it or not heh W i n d j u n g j talk / contr 03:03, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

How about this, Warglaive of Azzinoth and Warglaive of Azzinoth (off hand)
 ∙ Zurr  TalkContr 10:13, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

You expect a person like that to farm for something like that xD, id do it if i had TBC and it was out xd W i n d j u n g j talk / contr 06:02, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm a hunter, level 68. That one from Black Temple is awesome but our guild can't even get any of the Auchenai instances done on heroic, so I doubt we will ever get into Black Temple. Gathorlo 18:48, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

What kind of weapon are you looking for hmm? (1hSword/2hSword/FistWeapon/1hAxe/2hAxe/Stave etc.,.) Windjungj talk / contr 01:34, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

My only skills that are up to par are 1H axes, 1H swords, dagers, guns, and bows. Not that I couldn't go to the tram and kill rats for an hour and get a bunch of skil lthat way :) You coudl always look at my character on the armory too. My username is here is the same as my in-game main cahracter's name. Gathorlo 03:04, 6 July 2007 (UTC) , Korialstasz realm

Your best weapons typically depend on Specialization and ability to obtain. Pick up a Valanos' Longbow (20g on my server) until you get enough rep for the Thrallmar Exalted Bow. Other options are the guns that drop in Shadow Lab and Steam Vaults or the Bow from Black Morass. Again, the Bow from Thrallmar and loot from Karazhan surpass these.

Melee - For Survival spec get Terokk's Quill and get 35 Agility on it. For the other Specs get the Blackened Spear (Thrallmar Revered) or grind Shadow Lab until you get the Sonic Spear from Murmur.

The farther you progress in end-game content the better the weapons you will be able to get. By the time you get the best in the game now, it will no longer be the best in the game. Continual improvement should be what you're looking for.

Finding and listing drops for Alliance isn't worth my time.

FOR THE HORDE!!!!—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Darthbreetai (talkcontr).

Your last 2 statements were kind of stupid. Finding and listing drops for alliance? There was only two weapons you mentioned that alliance can't get, and they are from Thrallmar and Alliance has their equivalent weapons from Honor Hold. The statement for the horde shows you to be immature to bring faction quarrels outside the game, guess what, your neighbor plays alliance, are you going to egg his house?
 ∙ Zurr  TalkContr 21:25, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

The best item in game, according to calculating the item points is....... Devastation (weapon)
See the list at Thottbot.
-- Dyna18 11:12, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
Someone needs to update the entry for [Devastation (weapon)], since it is a pretty poor entry. I added some info and stubbed it. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 4:29 PM PDT 17 August 2007


ok i cant get my map coords on to WOW i got it on my docks page i downloaded it all but still i cant use /tloc whats goin on any suggestions? --Hellomoto28 23:24, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

It sounds like you downloaded the thottbot addon with you saying /tloc. First for you to be able to use we would need to know what operating system you are using. If it's OSX then just go to your applications folder, open world of warcraft, open interface, open addons, and drag the file you downloaded onto the addons folder. Log on and there should be a button at the bottom left corner of the screen that says addons. Click and make sure its an up-to-date version. Then click Enter World. Coords should work. Gathorlo 02:52, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
PS. I like Cartographer a lot better than thottbot. Thottbot seemed to take up to much memory and I lagged more. Just a suggestion. Gathorlo 02:53, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
My version of Cosmos uses /mntloc now. Not sure why they changed it, but you might try that. --Pcj (TC) 03:32, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

My Linux Is messing my wow up

Hello there, I need some facts about linux, and what can i do to make my wow as smooth as when i had windoes, but i kinda run wow on a wierd way, its a pogram opening a pogram, Hope some of you guys know any to this. --Mazi 08:49, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Check out the Linux article? Kirkburn talk contr 16:06, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
I run windows virtually on a SLED foundation. There are also crossover softwares that you can look into. That way I don't have .exe issues.  Nuurdientalk&contr 21:27, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Aldor reputation

Besides marks of serargas, where can you farm Aldor reputation?

--Tfria 22:57, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

There are quite some quests in Netherstorm, can't think of any other way  Flotsam | talk | contr )  12:10, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
There are the two types of Marks, Fel Armaments, and the Aldor specific quests in Netherstorm and Shadowmoom Valley. Once you finish with all the quests, you're stuck with item turn-ins. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 19:11, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Fire Mage Abuse 2

I am still fairly new to WoW and have selected to play as a mage and a warrior. I have read the comments on ice mages and fire mages, I must say that the comments are most interesting. I, for one am a fire and use arcane spells and until recently did select to become a fire mage. What made me change my mind was the dps of the fire mage and the abilities of the arcane talent tree. I am only 10/33/0 right now as a mage but have found that the combination of Arcane spells as well as those of the fire tree are most effective. Have I found it difficult to play as a mage compared to a Warrior, oh yes, but it has been alot of fun and it has shown fellow guild members that Mages are not as useless as they think we are!!! In addition being the ONLY mage in my guild gives me an advantage and that is SURPRISE!!! Mages, I have heard, are not as effective as other classes but I truly feel that they are one of the best Races to play! So for all the naesayers, respect your fellow mages and you will be surprised as to what we can do! I dont think that it really matters whether you decide to select to play as a fire mage or an ice mage its all about how u want to play and fell most comfortable! Thanks --Staker 18:09, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Everybody has an opinion. Some people think druids are useless. I personally don't. As you say, play what makes you happy. You're paying for the game, and you're better off playing something that makes you happy than something that makes you miserable. Although I don't think I've ever seen anyone say mages are useless... they're one of the better crowd control classes, and although it takes them a while to recover after doing big bada boom, when they hit something it stays hit pretty well. --Azaram 01:46, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I have yet to have a group turn down my mage when she needs a group. That cannot be said for my other characters. How a mage cannot be effective is a mystery to me. My first 70 was a hunter; my second a mage. I have 3 high 60s in other classes. So far the mage has ripped through content that gave each of the other classes pause. The thing that people forget is that versus humanoids/beasts mages can manage two super easily and even 3 with a bit of dancing. Getting beat on is what happens and I will gladly burn hits to get a job done. It does freak out a few non-mage playing players to see me let my mage tank a few hits, they always expect a blink or frost nova. What they fail to realize is the sheer DPS mages can put up, especially a fully developed fire mage. So many ways to break mobs, Blast Waveand Dragon's Breath allow stops mobs from attacking for a few seconds. Nova's and Ice Lance give incredible damage and CC.
Look at it this way, in every Instance Mages are there to put the mobs down. Melees are there to control aggro and keep mobs busy, healers are there to keep the Melees alive, and DPS classes put them down, the primary DPS class is the mage. There are situations where you need a Warlock but those also usually involve 10+ man raids. Hunters can do fill in provided the group knows how to work with one and the hunter is good. Half the time I play the mage I think I am playing WOW on easy-mode SharlinTalk / Did 09:13, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Some of the abuse mages take is their inability to temper their aggro and getting killed during tough fights. I went to Old Hillsbrad with my druid as a main heal (paladin as secondary) with a very experienced fire mage (he had done Kara a few times), but even he pulled too much aggro from our main tank a couple of times and wiped the group. It may be that some people have had a too many bad experiences with mages in PuGs, so they might turn you down. Otherwise, anyone who thinks mages (of any type) aren't useful is just ignorant. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 1:17 PM PDT 23 July 2007

Camping whats up with it?

On the Auchindoun server which is where I play why is it that the horde guys are all ways camping you. Ok I don’t mine getting axed now and then don’t get me wrong but when it is you and maybe 2 others and your ganked by 5 to 7 horde 10 + levels higher than you they want to sit on top of you so they can jump you again as soon as you res? Come on must of us just want to quest and have fun. If you kill me in the game why not go on and leave it at that why sit on the corpse and have your horde buddies also sit at the grave yard? I have killed a few horde but only camped 1 of them because I caught him along and him and his buddies set our bodies for over a hour one day so we did it to him to show him how it feels. I have even given free passes so to say to horde we have seen while out questing and they were by them selfs. We just waved and left them along, only to have them come back with some level 60+ dudes and camp us. What is up with that? Why all the camping BS? Don't get me wrong I am not a crybaby or anything like that but when 2 60+ and 3 30 - 50 horde jump a 38 and 2 36's and then sit the bodies for a hour plus, that is just plain sucks.

-- 18:04, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Your best move is to go to a PvE server. You won't have any of the camping and grieving so common on a PvP server, and you still can do PvP if you want to, but now at a controlled time, when you are up to it. -- Dyna18 11:43, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

People who do things like that are people with little respect, and probably set fire craclers to their own pets. I got tired of getting killed by skull'd players on a PvP server and the furthest I ever got was 46. That is when I moved to a PvE server.
 ∙ Zurr  TalkContr 19:09, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

The dude we camped is one of the ones that keeps camping us and they hunt in a area where we have to quest. So now every time he sees us he runs. The first couple of time we just blew him off and let him go. But, he keeps coming back with his buddies and we get ganked. Well yesterday we got him back. We had 3 people sitting the graveyard like they did us the last 2 times and 4 of us on his corps and we just devoted the whole day to nothing but stomping him down. Now today when I go to try to finish the last part of this chain quest I am expecting him and his buddies to pounce on me but I have a surprise for them. I have worked a deal with 3 70’s and a 68. I am going to be bait and am going to enjoy every min of it (I realy hate having to stoop to there level but I am tired of this BS 1 week trying to kill 20 different beast). It is bad when you are trying to work quest and the same bunch of skull’s and ?? keep camping your corps. Like I said you kill ok so your better that I am good. Just give me enough respect due and let me finish my quest before you kill me again. -—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gator (talkcontr).

Camping is a ever-present reality on PvP servers and the justifications for it are as myriad as the people who do it. If you have trouble with a ?? player camping you I'd recommend questing in a different zone for your level (see Zones by level) until the ganker leaves or just log off for 10-20 minutes. Or play on a PvE server. See Squar 22:37, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
I would have to say, get over it. Its part of the PvP lifestyle. It also is one of the reasons I would never play on any PvP server as I don't want my game time controlled by another SharlinTalk / Did 10:33, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Well with over 20 quest in SV it is hard to find a different area with that many quest for my level. I am playing on line with my son who is serving his country in Iraq and this way we can keep in touch once a week and he gets to enjoy the game at the same time, as they get 90 mins of computer time a week free. He has been trying to do 2 quest there four times in a row and getting slammed by horde. I can see some it but when they camp the area you have to turn the quest in and you’re a 30 with a 35 and a 38 and as you are trying to turn in quest you get jumped by 5 ?? and then there are a couple of skulls sitting the graveyard and they sit there for 45 minutes like they did Saturday, that sucks. Hey kill me once or even twice while I am questing that is cool I don’t care. But when you just sit there doing things like that then that is a low life SOB. If you want to do that much killing then go to the battle grounds, that is what they are for. Most of the horde playing guys I know and I know a few, one even works with me, said the guys doint that where SOB’s. This guy at work kills me about twice a week just to keep me in check then waves and moves on so do several others. But the dudes doing this are in the same area every day it seems like and it is always the same names. Even other horde guys know this bunch and don’t like them as a matter of fact 1 guy who is a horde is thinking of leaving this server because of them. This is the only US server my son can get on from where he is that is why I have no choice but to be on this server. I just wish that they would show a little respect now and then. I don’t think it is asking to much do you? - —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gator (talkcontr).

Unfortunately you've been smacked in the face with John Gabriel's Greater Internet F*wad Theory. The posibility that you might go somewhere to complain (which you did) is a joy to their little hearts. They're stupid, immature, and unfortunately here to stay. STV is known as "Gankerthorn Vale" on my server. The fact that there are a ton of quests in a relatively small area makes it great for questing and ganking. There are a few options you can try:
  1. Get in a guild with some high level people. When we hear about one of our lower level guys getting camped, it not uncommon for 3-4 of us 70s to head out to camp the campers.
  2. Start a set of alternate characters. Sometimes when I get camped, I'll just log out of that character (hoping the camper sits there forever waiting for me to come back) and I'll start playing another character.
  3. If you can get away from STV, there are several other zones (Badlands, Swamp of Sorrows, Desolace) that can provide different questing opportunities. On my 2nd character, I didn't complete a single STV quest. I was able to find enoug quests in other parts of the world.
Unfortunately, you and your son are stuck on a pvp server with a limited amount of time to play. While this does limit your options, it shouldn't completely prevent you from playing. And BTW, the Alliance camps just as often as the Horde. You wouldn't believe how frustrating it is to have a gnome jumping up and down on your corpse... - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 19:07, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Yea the Alliance dose camp also I have seen some of them do it and I blew the mind of a horde dude yesterday when I got between him and 3 Alliance dudes and stopped them from ganking him as he was along and just questing. I talked the Alliance guys out of it and they left. It did pay off when 3 Skulls came running up to me and out of no where this horde dude stepped up and tried to stop them 2 of them left but the 3rd guy did not. Not sure what was said as I can not understand Orkish but it looked like a argument between the 2 who were in the same guild. I ran into the horde dude and he was getting jumped by 2 panthers so I killed 1 of them to try and help him out as he was low on health. Then when it was done I waved at him and left. He ran up to me stopped in front of me and just stood there. I am a 41 and he was a 33 so I was not to worried as he was well below half on his health and I was full there was no since in killing him he was along and just questing. He looked me and then he waved, saluted and then bowed so I did the same and left. I saw where these 3 Alliance guys where chasing a horde and they were coming toward me when I saw who it was I stepped in as I don’t like one of the Alliance dudes any way. (We are voting to see if we kick him from the guild or not tonight as he has pissed every1 in the guild off and we as officers have received lots of complaints and now people are starting to leave because of him.) So any way I keep them from messing with him and even escorted him out of the area so that no one else would mess with him. I think it blew the minds of the Hordes because last night several just stopped to look at me and waved at me then went on. Some my lvl and lower and a couple of skulls. Makes you wonder don’t it.

I feel your pain. But that's how it is. I'd suggest moving, but not to a NORMAL server (unless you don't like to occasionally be on the other end of the sword). Go to an RPPvP server; I reccomend the Twisting Nether (my server). It's the Alliance that camps more on that server. Horde has an unspoken honor code where you kill once and walk away. What I do when I get camped is find some cover (if there's any around) and type /liedown. Then I rez. Hopefully the cover is enough that they can't see you. It should give you enough time to heal, eat/drink, or a decent head start on running. Today my 28 shaman got whooped by a 30 warlock. Since we were in Ashenvale, I had plenty of cover. Each time I rezzed, I'd take cover, rez, heal to full, wait a bit to get more mana, and there she was at my corpse. Snuck up and killed her. (Alright, she was soulstoned and killed me back). But then I did the same thing and killed her. The point is, you can survive AND dish out revenge if you want to. If they camp you, you may also consider asking for help on LocalDefense.
Ganking is fine. Deal with it. The Horde and Alliance are at war. You don't stop them from ganking people, you stop them from CAMPING people. I would be freaking INSULTED if someone from the Alliance stepped in and stopped me from getting killed. It'd be different if a lvl 70 Troll on an epic raptor stopped by and saved me in the knick of time, wiping the group. I'd only be grateful if I'd already been killed a thousand times by groups... but by that time I'd have left the area.
Some people feel that PVP doesn't have to be 'be as big a jerk as you possibly can until someone stronger comes and makes you stop'. --Azaram 07:36, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, those kind of people are nothing but an annoyance.
But yeah, gotta deal with it. You may want to put your leftover 80-or-so characters to use 'testing' out other servers (by making a toon called 'testchar' and talking to peeps on the server). But it's what you make it. Go kill people! Make a KoS list and get people to kill them on sight. Make 'em pay. The other day in STV I went to kill a mage two or three levels below me. I don't like to make my enemies that mad, so I did a quick /bow in wolf form while running up to take her down. Not only did she run, she ran into a group of buddies to try and kill me.
I killed her anyway for her cowardance and bad sportsmanship.
But then the three friends killed me, and they all camped me. I got some people their level to help me out (excluding my spirit it was 2 of us against 3 of them). They attacked, and in the confusion I rezzed, healed, and set down totems. Then, guess what?
And didn't camp them. Such poor warriors and poor sports, we came back and found out they were camping two or three guys again... they got a cat-druid to kill them while they rushed to kill the enemy group. God, I hate Alliance. Don't know how to fight, don't know the rules of war.
[this self-commentary was brought to you by Shinsen 23:48, 31 July 2007 (UTC)]

Sorry been gone a while. I see what your saying and I don’t mind getting axed so to say, but when you get several skulls and ?? all just hanging around killing 20 and 30 level people be they Alliance or Horde it is stupid. Hey kill me once ok then go on and if I run into you again and you kill me again fine do it. But don’t camp the places where everyone has to turn in the quest or be like the bunch of Horde I ran into yesterday in SV leaving Booty Bay there were some hanging around the Grave yard 3 were 48’s and 1 was a skull they let us pass so we could get killed up the road a bit by there buddies and if you resed at the grave yard those guys would ax you. I am still in the grave yard there as I just logged off and gave up I mean after a hour or so of that it is not worth it. Hell the horde even pounced on me at one point yesterday while I was AFK sitting on the road. This happened twice so I told a guy I was working with and he swapped and brought his 60 rouge on line and hid just off the road I sat down and typed /afk. About 5 mins later here they came 2 43’s and a 41. They did not like what they got that is for sure. We got the same guys 3 time doing that before they got the hint. The 5th time they came down the road they passed me by and we let them walk but made sure they knew we saw them. They came back a few mins later and jumped a 31 that was with us and we left them with a bad taste then also. It is always the same bunch there is a lot of horde and alliance that kill you on the road or while working quest and then leave you but there is a groups that just will not leave you be. There is a guild on the server that is a alliance guild that all they want to do is kill and camp horde. They have ask me and the guys I run quest with to join them all the time and we refuse our rule of thumb is if it is horde and 3 to 5 of us we let them go. If it is a fair match i.e. a skull against us as the highest guy we have is a 42 warrior then yea we will try or if there is 3 or 4 of them yea we will try but, if we run up on and we have many times, a say 20 or lower we wave and go on our way. We have had a few jump us as we pass them by which is kind of funny why would a 20 want to jump a group where the lowest level is a 38 Mage you got me but they have tried.

I guess I am using this forum as a vent and I hope yall don’t mind as I have to say I respect the responses’ that yall have left and the opinions yall have taken the time to share and thank you for the different way of looking at it. I guess some people just don’t seem to fit in at times and who knows maybe I am 1 of them that don’t fit in. But, I just see no need for these people (for lack of a better word) have to be such jerks as to do this. It is the same bunch over and over and I mean now killing some one who is AFK there is no honor points for that that is just plain stupid. Thanks again for your insite and letting me vent.

Which high end weapon enchant?

I'm just wondering which enchants to put on my duel-wielded swords. I have a Vindicator's with a speed of 2.60 and a Felsteel with a speed of 2.20. I'm looking at Mongoose but I don't know which sword would benefit more from it. Any advice? Thanks —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talkcontr).

They would both benefit the same if mongoose proc'd. The real question is which will it proc more from. Off-hand weapons have half the chance to proc. Even though your off-hand is faster, the main hand will proc more often. So, get the main hand enchanted first.
 ∙ Zurr  TalkContr 10:05, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
Assuming your a warrior I would say put it on your main hand, get strength or some other constant on your off hand. For a rogue its a toss up. The agility is key to your crit rate but you don't need a crit spree in an instance as your tank won't be able to save you. No Hunter should ever buy this or other melee proc enchantment as you never want to be in melee to use it. (not to op, but feral druids cannot benefit from it either) SharlinTalk / Did 10:31, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
I dw mongoose on my lvl 70 rogue. As I understand it mongoose is a proc-per-minute enchant so it should consistently proc off of either weapon no matter the speed of the weapon. I find I have at lesat one if not two buffs running form procs off of my weapons. It never gives me aggro issues and the extra 120-240 agility is a lot of fun. Mucke - Blameme 22:14 pm, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Improve game performance / FPS

To avoid cluttering things further, I'll add a link here to my talk page and move this there. User_talk:Azaram

How to reset UI ?

I have some trouble on my old computer. I saw somewhere a script command to reset the User Interface which is pretty usefull to me, something like "/script ResetUi", but i can't find it out again. Does someone remember it ? Thanks . --Sargeras (fr pvp server) 00:39, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

/console ReloadUI will just refresh your current interface. If you want a full UI reset, you can delete/rename the WTF folder found in your WoW folder. --GRYPHONtc 00:41, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Priest changes from WoW forums

Does anyone happen to have, or have any idea where to find, the suggested skills and talent trees from the linked thread on the WoW forums? 17:20, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Character order

Is there any way to change the order of your characters when you first log on?

--Gpig 07:19, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

None that I am aware of. I have even seen this in the WoW suggestion forums, people asking for this option to be implemented. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 16:33, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
Nope. I don't understand the practicality of even doing so (not that I wouldn't change it)...thus Blizzard is going to sit and watch their buyers squirm, kinda like with my SHOULDERPAAAAAADS *cries*
*wipes tear from eye* seriously tho idk if they'll ever mess with the order

--Shinsen 23:37, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Furbolg Skinner Trainer

Hi there,

The furbolg's will not talk to me and I want to learn skinning from their trainer. Is this a reputation or language isssue?


--Ieper 17:01, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Question, why would you want to learn skinning from their trainer? There are skinning trainers in or near every major city. As for their trainer not talking to you< i would guess you need at least friendly rep to get him to train you --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 17:43, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
(This may be a spoiler, but ...) I believe the only trainer near Azure Watch is a furbolg, and you can't understand the language until you complete certain quests. So, you can choose: travel to a different skinning trainer, or wait till you've done the other quests. Not saying which ones to preserve some sense of adventure. :-) Plus I might be wrong. Harveydrone ( talk | work ) 19:59, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
Cool. You may have been the first person I've seen worry about adventure spoilers. I wish that was common practice. --Droffats 08:31, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
Rock on! Independence!
(background music) U S A! U S A!
=P --Shinsen 23:35, 31 July 2007 (UTC)


I don't have any addons currently on my computer, but it's getting a bit frustrating in STV when I can't give people my coordinates (so I can call in a lvl 50 or so to kill the twink who's ganked me AND my party member forty of fifty times). I can't even seem to get a hold of a good tut to get me into this. So, what... do I just save the addon file into the mod folder of the WoW program file? Or is it more complicated than that? Also, what mods/addons would you suggest? Link plz --Shinsen 18:15, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

The simplest method is. Download the mods you think you need. In your case I would suggest a compilation like Ace2/Fubar related mods or Titan Panel. Normally these come down as a .ZIP file. You open the .ZIP file and within should be a folder. Copy that entire folder to your \world of warcraft\wtf\interface\ directory.
for more information and lots of links use this page : UI FAQ/Addons SharlinTalk / Did 12:22, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, mah friend! I wish you woulda linked like I said = / but I guess I'll have to deal with that lol I can probably get 'em of, thanks! --Shinsen 23:28, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Best sides of a Paladin

Everyone playing as a paladin has to notice the good parts being a one....self healing...being tough to kill....etc.But my real guestion to you all you think paladins are one of the easiest classess to play?=)

--Qerka 18:19, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Hm. All classes take a different mindset, really. I wouldn't say that they're the easiest class to play... against npcs, yeah, sure, pretty easy. But if someone purges the paladin of buffs, you die. Definately takes some skill in PvP. PvE isn't too tough, but that's kind of obvious (self heals, plus NPCs don't usually purge).
No matter what, tho, they're my second easiest class to kill ^______^ Mages take first place
Shamans ftw!
--Shinsen 23:33, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
At the first BlizzCon, the devs said (in my words, as I don't recall theirs) that one of the considerations when designing the paladin class was a gentle learning curve, as they expected and intended the class to be appealing to new players, and some people took this as an admission that paladins are "easy mode". I haven't taken a paladin past the mid-twenties, but while they certainly seemed to be easier to start playing than some other classes (*cough*druid*cough*), I don't know that I'd call them the easiest. I think that once you get used to playing WoW in general, most of the classes balance out pretty well in terms of easiness of play. // DarkRyder / Gossipgossipicon / Trainergossipicon // 00:16, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
Ease of play order in my book. Hunter Mage Warlock Druid Rogue Priest Shaman Paladin Warrior. Ease doesn't mean easy to learn to play, but how easy it is to get through content. Though recently I am really beginning to wonder what beats a Druid in PvE in Outlands for solo play ease SharlinTalk / Did 12:13, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
PS: My Paladin was my 3rd 70th level character, after my Hunter and Mage. SharlinTalk / Did 12:14, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
For the early levels, the mail wearers are the easiest to play because not many mobs cast spells at you and your armor is so much better than the leather/cloth wearers. On a recent paladin I started, I sent a few gold to the mailbox for them and they bought the normal armor set from the vendor in Goldshire. That made the armor advantage even more pronounced, since now they had about 60% damage reduction against the stuff they were fighting. Once you get to the mid teen levels the other classes have ramped up damage and kiting ability enough so that the armor isn't so much of a deal anymore. In short, I think the cloth classes are a tad bit harder to get going up to level 20 but after that, if you play to the strengths, all the classes can be 'easy'. The hybrids (Druid, Paladin, Shaman) do have the nice solo setup of decent damage mitigation and self healing though. --Dga 16:48, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Installation Question

Howdy everyone, I intend on joining the World Of Warcraft, and I have a quick question on how the installation works. For you see, I am soon to buy a new computer, and am wondering if I could install WoW on my current computer, and play until I get the new one - uninstall from the old, and reinstall on the new. Would my registration code be rejected? Or would it be reusable as long as I uninstalled first?

--Veneratiounus 11:06, 1 August 2007 (UTC)Lolitsme

You can have a copy of WOW installed on any number of computers. The registration code is linked to the account, not the computer. You could even play on the old computer and simply copy the directory over to the new one when you get it. SharlinTalk / Did 12:01, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
That's definitely the best way to do it now, especially since the game has been patched so many times. I recently built a new computer and installed my old hard drive as a slave drive on the new computer. Copied my almost entire World of Warcraft folder over to the new hard drive and I was playing in just a few minutes. No messy registry entries to fix either. If you do copy, there are a few things you don't need to bring over. Any of the downloaded patches can stay behind. Your Cache folder can also stay behind since its usually pretty large. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 22:22, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Night Elves' Origin. Help!

Hi all, I'm planning on making a little movie about Night Elves' origin, i know it not clear at all, but i'd like to make out of my own theory. Sorry in advance for any mistake with the english language, i'm not native speaker ;)

I'm on the side of Elune's origin, and after reading a bit through the net i found a lot of "empty" spaces inside the stories... Of course the help i need is from someone who knows a lot about warcraft lore, since i'm only a newbie, still have to read all the books xD, but i'm not sure that they would solve my questions...

First of all, the reason why im on the Elune's Origin side is as it follows: We've got 2 origins, trolls or Elune, so i stick to the one that matches exactly physically with night elves, which is Elune, and not the ones that have some "similar" things, now, How do i "know" Elune's appereance is that of a night elf? by these facts: First I thought of the Statue of Darnassus and said ok, if that's how Elune looked then it's obvious night elves descended from her, then i thought, mmm wait, who says that statue was made from real Elune's looks? maybe night elves just made a statue of their goddess using their own look since they've never seen hers. Then i came up with another thing: Cenarius (that looks half stag, half night elf) was born from the union of Elune + Malorne, Malorne was a Stag, which explains the stag half of Cenarius, the night elf looking half was then from?? :P Elune. OF course i can be wrong, that's why i type it all here, to be corrected if so ^^.

After getting that clear, i tried to read about the list of descendants from Elune + Malorne and it's kind of confusing during some points because... There are no mothers! Who are the mothers of the ppl i'm gonna name next?!!!! if someone knows i'd be really thankfull since i think that's the clue of the night elf origin. Let me explain myself:

From Cenarius, it's said his children were keepers of the grove and dryads, both looking almost like him, half stag-half night elf, but who were their mother?, and the important thing comes here... Malfurion Stormrage is also named to be his son, but he doesn't have 4 stag legs! but 2 night elf legs! Why does he lose much of the stag resemblace? Obviously because of who his mother was. And that i want to know T_T

Another doubt is that Malfurion Stormrage is said to be Cenarius' son, and Illidan Stormrage is said to be Malfurion's twin brother, but never named to be Cenarius son too? So they share mother but not father? and who are they????

Well, i guess no one will find and answer, but thanks for the time anyway :)--DiosaWoW 16:38, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Cenarious was Elune and Malorne's child, no one knows if Elune made them or if they were trolls, no one knows who was the mate of Cenarius, and Malfurion was his student not son.--SWM2448 19:08, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

My theroy (One made of my own love of the lore) is that they where a spawn of the Old Gods (Who I am opsessed with) But not the Kaldorie. I mean a More feral version. One that Looked to Zanndalar Trolls as other trolls. After the olgd gods defeat they migrated to a massive fount of magic power. The Well of Eternity. B eing used to basking in the presence of an Old God this new magic fount proably was 100X more powerful. Eventualy over the Appc. 10,000 years till the War of the ancients they Evolved into their Now known state. -Agamemmnon September 18, 2007

Pet Experience

Does anyone know how much experience pets gain per kill/how much they gain as a percentage of level compared to the hunter?

I'm asking because my hunter currently has two pets, which require monster killing instead of quests to keep up with the hunter in experience. I have noticed that I can level both my pets up a level with some extra experience to spare on my hunter, but would like to be able to fine tune how my hunter's levelling is done. Minionman 02:14, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

You might want to check out one of the experience related addons. I know some of them track the amount of experience that pets have. An example is ExperienceFu over at I know it can track the percentage of experience a pet has. It might even show the exact amount, although I can't remember for sure. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 15:26, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
When I checked this in-game, a while ago, I think based on one random kill, I saw that my pet got the same experience that an unrested player character of the same level would have gotten. I'm pretty sure I've seen that corroborated somewhere, so I use it as a guideline. It's not a percentage compared to the hunter (as far as I can tell). It only depends on the level of the pet and the level of the mob (and the hunter must also gain some exp from the kill). But the points needed to level is different. I don't know the formula for that. -- Harveydrone ( talk | work ) 22:41, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
I believe that the pet gets equal to what the hunter would get unrested, regardless of pet level. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 04:13, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
My notably non extensive testing ( looking at the pet XP after every kill ) noted that the pet (1 level below me) was getting the amount of XP ( unrested ) I got for each kill. They do not get rest bonus and get no XP for turning quests. They also need much less XP than you do for each level. If you hover over the pet XP bar in the pet frame, it will tell you the current/max for the level. Pets also do not gain any experience when they are your level so you have to level up, for them to start to gain the XP for their next level. --Dga 16:56, 31 August 2007 (UTC)


Number One: Not one single location in World of Warcraft is exactly the size it should be. Kalimdor, the Eastern Kingdoms and Outland are nowhere near the size of a continent.
Number Two: This isn't a "powerful new faction" this is an old faction that is just revealing its true power.
Misc.: Given the fact that Rhonin is apparently going to be leading operations in Northrend, this leaves Ansirem Runeweaver to deal with matters in Dalaran proper. As for the undead knocking at the door, consider that Sylvanas is now pouring her energies into invading Northrend. Dalaran didn't "suddenly master" anything- they've been the second-most powerful mages in Azeroth for centuries. As for their attitude to the Horde, that was supposed to have changed years ago.
In short, get over yourself, this is an encyclopedia, not a forum or a lobbying office. --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 14:28, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
If you play with the math, continents are somewhere along the lines of 10-15 miles long. Small world eh? TeжubԎ Ҩ Ѡ 10:31, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
This isn't actually as far-fetched as it sounds. The devs mentioned during one of the panels that this is what they've had in mind for Dalaran since the beginning (of WoW, that is). The dome visible in Hillsbrad is a side-effect of a spell the Kirin Tor has been constructing for years with the express purpose of moving the city. Malygos currently presents a clear and present danger to every mortal magic user on Azeroth, and that's definitely caught their attention. So, they're moving Dalaran to where it can best serve as a base of operations in the war with the blue dragonflight and, oh look, Arthas is getting uppity, so they'll help anyone looking to spank him while they're in the neighborhood. (As a side note, wasn't it Archimonde who attacked Dalaran rather than Arthas?) // DarkRyder / Gossipgossipicon / Trainergossipicon // 18:20, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Archie was just the finishing blow. Arthas lead the seige.--SWM2448 18:33, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Did I miss something? This thread seems to be a response to a statement that is now missing. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 1:39 PM PDT 24 Aug 2007
He removed it a while ago... I would of put it back but feared the possible results.--SWM2448 21:47, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Therefore, I suggest that we create a petition to take no action whatsoever, given that this is an encyclopedia, not a forum or a lobbyists' office

  • --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 14:28, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
  • --Pcj (TC) 14:36, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
  • --Schmidt 14:45, 7 August 2007 (UTC) (whatever that's worth to anyone)
This doesn't really affect the wiki... so.. whatever your opinion on dalaran is,, the wiki will display what is in game.  - CJ talk / cont  15:12, 7 August 2007 (UTC)


how do you know what coordinance like 22,73 or 59,19 are at? how do you find this on the map? --Lindseth1234 01:28, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

See Map Coordinates
 ∙ Zurr  TalkContr 01:54, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Character building website

I loved using CTProfiles to compare different sets of gear, but it's not online any more. Does anyone know a similar site?

RPGOutfitter allows you to upload you character right to their site with all its gear, professions, and inventory. It does not, however, allow you to build sets like CTprofiles did, but according to thier message boards it is an option they are working on implementing. WoWDigger is a new site similar to RPGOutfitter. I am not sure of what features they have as I haven't tried it. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 17:58, 18 August 2007 (UTC)


Yo! I was wondering if there was a way to find out what items look exactly or almost exactly the same as other items. The specific item in-question right now is the Bloodhawk Claymore, as one of my roleplay characters has a kind of "family heirloom from the Second War" which is...kind of a High Elven sword. However, I realize that the Bloodhawk Claymore isn't going to last me forever. Even now, a few levels ahead, I find my damage dwindling... So in short, I'd like to know if there are any other two-handed swords that look exactly like the Bloodhawk Claymore. ~ Doc Lithius (U)(T)(C) 02:25, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

I went to the WoW Model Viewer site and downloaded the most recent item list csv file. This file is a comma-delimited file. Each line represents an item in the game. The second value in each record is the model ID. The Bloodhawk Claymore has a model ID of 37415. No other item matched that same ID. So right now, it looks like the model only matches one item (although this item list could be incomplete).- ClydeJr - talk - contrib 16:56, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

# Factions

World of Warcraft is horrible because it ruins the lore of the series. Most people don't even pay attention when there IS lore mentioned in the game. Most people are ignorant of the in-game histories.

Why is it that there are only two playable factions: Alliance & Horde? Surely it would make sense to add Independent, Scourge, and Burning Legion factions as well to cover all other races.

Why are the two playable factions enemies? I thought they were allies?

Why is the Alliance always portrayed as "good guys" (Lawful Good) and the Horde as "bad guys" (Chaotic Evil)?

Why isn't there a Common tongue for the two factions to communicate?

For these reasons, I consider the Warcraft RPG to be superior to the video game in every way. --Zenosaga 14:50, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

You, sir, are stating the obvious. It's like saying the novel version of Jurassic Park was better than the movie version. Well of course the tabletop Warcraft RPG is better! It has far, far more detail than they could put into the video games, for one thing. For another thing, you have to realize that as a video game for the masses, there's bound to be limitations and constrictions.
You ask why there's only two playable factions. Simple. The first reason that comes to mind is "marketability". If they'd had everything -- and I mean everything -- open from the get-go, they couldn't continue to make expansion packs and whatnot for people to buy and/or they'd have to charge far, far more a month for their game play service as the game would be that much bigger. Further, there really can't be any truly "neutral" factions to play because in any good game, there's always two or more opposing forces. Mario vs. Koopa... GDI vs. Nod... The Final Fantasy heroes vs. some randomly generated bad guy... It's all symmetry. If you threw neutral factions into the works, they couldn't really be neutral unless they were all entirely marketeers, such as the Steamwheedle Cartel or something. How interesting would it be to play as the Tuskarr up in Northrend, fishing and whaling and doing what they do all day? Or running around as a gnoll just trying to survive and claim food or land for yourself? Not terribly interesting, if you ask me, and certainly not worth $59.99 per expansion.
You ask why the two playable factions are enemies. They're not. Nowhere is it stated that the Alliance and the Horde are at war with one-another. As has been stated time and time again, the two major factions of Azeroth are simply in a state of "uneasy peace" with each other. Little quarrels for land and resources break out in various places that border specific areas, sure... But for the most part, these are isolated incidents. You'll notice the Alliance isn't asking you to go into Warsong Gulch... No, the folks of the Silverwing Sentinels have come into the cities asking for outside assistance. Sure, the leaders could just as easily have pushed them outside their cities...but they're obligated to let them ask for help as they're allied. No...there is no true "faction vs. faction all-out war" going on... What happens between guilds of players and random players is strictly non-canonical, regardless of server type. Unless Warcraft IV comes out and officially states that Illidan, Arthas, and the leaders of the various towns are dead...then they aren't.
Tying into this, you claim that the game is ruining the lore. Well, keep something in mind... In World of Warcraft...there is no real lore in the making. I know this may be hard to wrap your head around, but what happens in WoW kind of stays in WoW unless otherwise stated by Blizzard.
You ask why the Alliance are portrayed as "the good guys" and the Horde portrayed as "the bad guys". Once again, this is rubbish. It's all in the eye of the beholder, really. Sure, a couple of factions of the Horde are a little on the idiotic or psychotic side in our eyes, but as I said... That's in our eyes. Imagine, if you will, if you suddenly lost your mind and body to a powerful entity, fought to gain your mental freedom, gained it, found your emotions had been all but dulled, then tried to return to your point of origin only to be shunned and burned with fire. There you have the Forsaken's point of view. They're still who they were in life... Just...not quite "as full of life," if you'll pardon the unintentional pun. As such, they seek vengeance against those who've done them wrong. Pretty much the same story with the sin'dorei... The orcs, though? The trolls? The tauren? They're all just trying to get by... To live their lives. They want nothing more than peaceful days. It just hasn't come to pass yet...
You ask why there's no common "Common" language. This...I can't explain. I don't know why, all of a sudden, orcs and the Forsaken can't talk with humans or sin'dorei can't talk with quel'dorei. If, according to Blizzard's own lore, "almost all intelligent races speak Common", then by all rhyme and reason, that should be what's going on! My only guess as to why this is as such is because Blizzard didn't want things like spies happening, or inter-faction communication gumming up the works. I believe there was a testing of giving the Forsaken the ability to speak Common (instead of Gutterspeak), but I also recall hearing from someone who was there that some seriously bad mojo happened. Maybe it was because only the Forsaken could speak Common? Maybe not. I don't know, I wasn't there. The point is, conventional inter-faction communication was apparently enough of a threat to the serenity of the game that Blizzard decided against it in the end.
Anyway, that's all I've got. Hopefully, this answers your questions, or even brings up further questions I or someone else can answer. ~ Doc Lithius (U)(T)(C) 15:34, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
The wall of text critted you for 100.000k wiki damage. --Ose 22:28, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

For all you horde players

This one is for all you horde players out there(especially dunemall players) annoying are gnomes, they're small enough to step on but tough enough to murder you (lol). If a gnome has done anything funny to you or if you've done anything funny to them please post it up here. --matt.y 16:29, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

You seem to have missed the entire point of both this page and the wiki. --Ragestorm (talk · contr) 16:30, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
I'd go with Ragestorm on that, but this is too good to pass up. Awesome things I've done to gnomes... heh, me and meh bud, both orcs, ganging up on one red-lvl mage. Which reminds me how funny it is when they fall XD
I love it when an undead kills a gnome and then eats it. They usually cancel the effect early and say something along the lines of "That didn't take long..."
Lastly, I really enjoy the general chat about the unique taste (literally) of each race. Gnomes are generally described as having a smoked flavor XD
Shinsen 00:04, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Loading Decursive mod on a Mac

Help!!! I recently switched from Windows to a Mac. I've loaded most of my favorite mods successfully but can't figure out how to install Decursive. My main is a resto Druid so missing this one mod can result in tragedy! Please help (begging), I'm not computer friendly so all and any help will be appreciated. Or maybe the name of another cleansing mod if Decursive is just impossible. Thanks all. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Aszuna (talkcontr).

Decursive has been changed over to an Ace2 addon. Check out It has the latest version there. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 18:17, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Raid Requirements for a Rogue

I am a combat swords rogue on Spinebreaker, and have:

Approx 1300 atk power in combat spec (currently in subtle spec for arena) 286 hit rating +5% to hit from talents 19.50% crit chance 5.7k HP

I am a 358 LW and am working towards the primalstrike set, and am greatly interested in raiding Karazhan.

My question is, which one of my abilities should I focus on improving next/the most before I raid, or am I raid ready?

Thank you in advance, Drelidan -- Drelidan7 08:51, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I would say focus on your hitpoints first. At level 70 a raiding rogue, imho, should have 7000 unbuffed HP to start and 8500 ideally. Many fights are not friendly to melee so surviving the fights should be your #1 priority. After that work on agility, +hit and AP. The rest of your stats should come along nicely on their own. If you like you can see what I have done with my rogue here Mucke (currently raiding Karazhan and Gruul's Lair). -- BlameMe Mucke talkTo 04:05, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Character Re-customization in Wrath of the Lich King

I've been reading up on the new features that come with this 2nd expansion pack, and one new feature is being able to change the look of your character. I've only read that you will be able to change your hairstyle, skin color, and dance moves.. but my question is will you also be able to change the look of your face aswell? I'm playing as a male night elf and I'm wanting to turn myself into a demonhunter, which would include me wearing a blind fold. Does anyone happen to know if face changing will be possible in the new expansion? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Warl0rd25 (talkcontr).

Plastic surgery won't be in the expansion, no :) Kirkburn talk contr 19:08, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
Damn >.> -- Shinsen 00:15, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Kael killing blood elves

Hello again! It's me...Kapteeni40! I am just asking a simple question. In the Tempest Keep Kael'thas Sunstrider is the final boss of The Eye. Why is he killing blood elves who reaches to him? Kael is King of the blood elves! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kapteeni40 (talkcontr).

He is crazy. Those who went with him to Outland in TFT are the only ones he cares about, he did let some pilgrims join is ranks, but that was before people knew he joined the Legion for power.--SWM2448 19:17, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


Could stand for Dark Tales (or Dull Title, as you want). I am currently working on this WoW motion picture as the scenarist and the English subtitler. We have recently released a "buzz" (technical displaying teaser), that you can see here and here. This video might be discreet about its lore-respecting nature, but I swear I did my best to make it fit the universe of Warcraft (never mind the dual Ashbringers, it was just a test). Any feedback?--K ) (talk) 19:53, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

First link ( doesn't work for me, but the second one did. The teaser looks cool, but the scenes seem a bit rushed and the two-sword holding demon does a strange move at the end (looks like a death played in reverse). Looking forward to longer clips. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 4:30 PM PDT 15 Aug 2007

this looks really awesome :) looking forward to the full thing. how long will it be btw? --Hit man 11:53, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Trying to make a screenshot macro!

Hi there,

I've been poring over the wow /console and other slash commands, but haven't found all the stuff I need for what I want. Here's what I'm trying for.

/console set unitnameplayer "0"

  • a command that hides the user interface!*
  • a command that takes a screenshot!*
  • a command that brings back the user interface, probably the same base command as the hiding the UI*

/console set unitnameplayer "1"

So, I essentially want a one button screenshot, without any of the gui stuff, and then bringing back up my ui. Is this possible? There's already a bindable command to toggle the UI, but the screenshot of alt printscreen isn't in there, and anyways I want it in a macro. I'm not sure where to go from here, so I'm hoping someone has tried this before. Thanks for your time.

All of that stuff is beyond me, but I generally just press Alt and Z at the same time on my keyboard, and then press the screenshot button.
-- Shinsen 00:13, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Something along the lines of the following should work (I've replaced /console calls with SetCVar to keep things in one line; Screenshot() actually takes a screenshot, and hiding/showing UIParent should hide/show most of the UI frames):
/script SetCVar("UnitNamePlayer", 0); UIParent:Hide(); Screenshot(); UIParent:Show(); SetCVar("UnitNamePlayer", 1);
-- Starlightblunder 09:42, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Using to do teambuilding

We will need to build a means for bringing together teams and resources to meet a common goal...can I use Warcraft to simulate teambuilding.


-- FSRwar 14:22, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

You can, but I don't think it would be that useful as an analog to real-world situations. World of Warcraft has a bit too much anonymity to effectively represent in-person interactions. Also, if for example you group with someone you don't like, unless you are in a guild with that person, you can just avoid them. Even if you're in a guild its relatively easy to avoid someone. Teambuilding exercises generally try to focus people on shared goals for future development knowing they will have to work together in the future. WoW doesn't really work like that alot of the time. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 10:42 AM PDT 13 Sep 2007

Goblin or Gnomish Engineering?

I'm new to engineering. I'm still in the low-levels of it, but I need to decide which path I'll take before I get to the choice. I chose engineering for the PvP trinkets/equipment--which would give me that? I've been looking at Goblin for the Goblin Rocket Launcher alone >.> I'll take anything that gives me an edge in PvP. Which line will give me that? Is there no difference in PvP usefulness? Is it just a matter of preference of items? Plz help. -- Shinsen 00:12, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Okay, no one has jumped in to answer this question, so I'll make an attempt. From my experience with Gnome ngineering, I'd probably pick Goblin for the better offensive variety of stuff, but especially the [Goblin Jumper Cables XL] if you aren't a rezzing class. Gnome engineering has a lot of fun, but dubiously useful stuff. People argue both sides, but Goblin would probably work better in PvP without having to be too clever. You really should look at the Gnome Engineering and Goblin Engineering articles carefully to make your decision based on what is both useful for your class and your play style. You can switch between the two, but it is time consuming, expensive and potentially bugged. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 6:35 PM PDT 12 Sep 2007
Read the official forums... engineering is basically useless after 60. Few if any of the bombs or items work on anything over level 60, and the ones that do are ridiculously expensive (Someone on the forums once said that the lauded frost grenade was like throwing 5g at someone). Gnome engineering gives you fun but nearly worthless toys, goblin gives you nearly worthless explosives. Even the XL jumper cables only have like a 30% chance (by observation, again from the forums) to work.. .which is better than nothing. (Gnome engineers can use the goblin cables XL, by the way; they just can't make them.) The professions forum is . Apparently, there have been some recent changes made; you now get 10 frost grenade primers instead of the two you used to, so they're a bit cheaper, and parachute cloaks have a 30 second instead of 30 minute cooldown. But like I said before you decide, (if it's not too late) see what people who have it say.

Why can't there be a new faction?

Why can't there be a new faction, such as the Independents (various "other" races), the Scourge (various undead/cultists), or the Burning Legion (various demonic races)? --Zenosaga 00:55, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

It is not Blizzard's will.--SWM2448 01:10, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
That is basically it. The balancing between 2 factions is hard enough, 3 would be a lot to add. Plus fitting them in BGs and current world pvp objectives would be a pain in the... So yeah, it basically comes down to whether Blizzard wants to put in the time and money to add another faction. If the cost/time isn't worth it to them, in their minds, it will never happen. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 07:00, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
It would be alot of work for Blizzard, but you can some ideas at WoWWiki talk:Warcraft pump#Full of Neutrality that describe ways to possibly add a 3rd faction in a feasible manner. Since Blizzard potentially has revenues in the hundreds of millions of dollars (possible over a billion a year), they can definitely afford it. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 2:18 PM PDT 24 Aug 2007

HELP.. I've been trying to download and play WoW for Two Days!!

I installed the 14 Day Trial starter disc. After going through all the Firewall errors and successfully installing I tried to log in. I got a patch and patch after patch after patch. I log in, it takes me through a "Handshaking" message and then tells me that it is "Successfully installed, click to restart WoW". I do and it takes me through it all over again and again and again. I read through the quick start and I "know" i'm suppost to pick a Realm and creat a character. I click on the link that tells me to "choose a realm" but all I get is a "screenshot" of the Realm Selection page. No where can I get to this page. I've tried every link possible. I can't find it. I've tried "searching" it. Nothing! I would really love to play this game. Can anyone help??

Thank you MagickReligion

-- MagickReligion 01:41, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Well creating a character and selecting a realm is done after you log into the game. Once you have caught up on patches just launch wow, log-in and go. Not sure if this helps but this should be all there is to it.--BlameMe Mucke talkTo 06:24, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for replying to this. That is exactly the problem. It takes me through the patches. Only "two". I sign in and go through the whole "Handshaking" message. It takes me to the next page where it tells me that the download was successful and to click to restart. It takes me to the same patch. Then I get a message telling me I already downloaded WoW and don't need this again. I click "OK" and have to do this all over again and again and again. It never takes me to the next page where I assume is to pick a realm and create a character. Thank you for your time.


I could advise you to get the latest patch from a file server such as or whatever your preference is. The latest patch is 2.1.x, so if you find one for 2.1 that you can download, I'm fairly certain the official WoW updater should be able to finish it off by downloading precisely the correct patch in case the one you get isn't exactly the latest one. I hope this is helpful. Schmidt 14:21, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Also, contacting WoW tech support via e-mail or phone would be a good idea. They are the experts so to speak. Here is a link to the tech support page Wow Tech Support -- BlameMe Mucke talkTo 22:29, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Check to make sure that you only have one copy of WoW on your computer. It sounds like you might have at least two... you launch copy A, it notices that it's out-of-date, gets the patch, and launches it. The patch finds copy B and sees that it's up-to-date. You then launch copy A, it notices that it's out-of-date... // DarkRyder / Gossipgossipicon / Trainergossipicon // 20:24, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Magick, perhaps you should contact Blizzard's tech. support? Voluspå

I'd suggest checking the version at the bottom left corner of the screen from the log-in screen. It should say something like "Version 2.1.3..." as well as a date (Jul 3 2007). If it doesn't say that, it is downloading upgrades, that's why it's taking forever. --slxception (me/speak) 14:33, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

if Blood elves don't praise Elune, then who?

I'm curious, just started a belf priest and have no idea where to direct her faith! Crying out "Remember the Sunwell" is all fine and well but worshiping a Sunwell just feels wrong... it lacks personality... Atvia 16:20, 22 August 2007 (UTC) // L70 Argent Dawn

Some WoWWikians (and probably fans in the wider community) have theorized that An'she might be a sun god known to the elves by another name, as Mu'sha is Elune and Apa'ro is Malorne. Since Elune was the moon goddess of a noctural people, the diurnal people might have taken to a sun god. It is also not quite out of the realms of possibility that a few blood elven priests still follow Elune or praise, having been minority followers for millenia or recent converts.-_Ragestorm (talk · contr) 13:28, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
They call the sun Belore if it helps.--SWM2448 21:39, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Many thanks for the responses! Atvia

Woo Ping

I was watching Jet Li's Fearless and in the credits there was a guy named Wo Ping. -- Monkey Noob 17:25, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, you've caught one of the many cultural references in World of Warcraft. Yuen Woo Ping is a famous martial arts choreographer. Seems appropriate that a weapon master would be named Woo Ping. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 2:26 PM PDT 24 Aug 2007


ok i have a level 15 rogue who is currently a skinner/leatherworker, i alsohave a level 7 druid who is herb/alchemist,i have both a level 9 wArrior and mage my warrior is a miner at the moment

question is; are my characters too low levelled to benefit from crafting proffestions? would it be better to make two skinners/miners and two skinners/herbologists?

whats a good level range to switch to switch to a crafting proffesion?

oh and when i do level my characters to the 50 range could you tell me whats worth getting/whats just a money sink. -- Cweetiepie 16:14, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Moved Voluspå 16:32, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

It all depends on how much money you want to spend on your professions. Leveling them as you go you tend to spend less because most of your mats you get as you go along. To level a profession at a higher level would require either storing tons of mats for a long time, going back and spending hours farming low-level mats, or spend all your gold on mats to get your profession up to par. That said, at high levels getting a profession up can be really easy to do. Also, if you are gathering only you might make enough gold selling mats to make it worth your while, making the gold cost of power leveling a prof trivial. Personally I try and pick professions that benefit my characters as well as balance with my other characters. I like to level them from the get go because I really don't like the idea of switching around a lot. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 16:34, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
Most professions can benefit you at low level, but patience and a little research is your best ally. I have characters with all professions (most over 300 and a few over 350) and so I've learned a bit about all of them. The worst professions for making money are blacksmithing and engineering until you get to higher levels. The best money making professions are gathering ones, especially herbalism and mining. Skinning works okay for making money at lower levels, but less so at higher levels in my experience. For the crafting professions, alchemy and tailoring work pretty good for making money followed by jewelcrafting and maybe leatherworking. It's good to have an enchanting alt for disenchanting unwanted magic items.
If you want to switch, switching gathering professions is safest since you don't really need to gather recipes to re-level up the new profession. I'd also recommend looking for good deals at the AH for mats regularly. However, like Mucke said, you should choose professions that complement your characters if possible. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 10:25 AM PDT 25 Aug 2007
If you have several characters on the same server and the same horde/alliance side, also consider how the professions interact. If you have several leather wearers, one leatherworker can make armor for all of them. A couple of herbalists will make alchemy go a lot easier to level, same with two miners and blacksmithing/engineering. In your case, you've picked professions pretty well to cover these situations.
The other people here have described the professions in general pretty well, however, there are ways with all of them to increase money at low/medium levels, by watching the auction houses, you can often find recipes that are good for levelling and can actually sell for some good money. (Thick Bronze Darts were nice for my blacksmith paladin, for instance.) If you pick a profession to be useful for your class/account of character, these recipes can help out a lot. Even selling crafted green items at the auction house at a loss can often still loose less than vendoring them, and disenchanting them can also possibly help with money.
At your current levels however, I recommend just making basic trade goods such as rough grinding stones and bolts of linen, until those items don't skill up anymore. When you hit around skill level 50 in the crafting profession, you will have enough raw materials saved up to quickly gain several more levels up to 60-70 or so depending on profession, and the items will be somewhat worth something at auctions or vendors.
Hopefully that all made sense. Good luck with the professions Minionman 00:35, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Ok! Professions is how it's spelt. 1 f, 2 ss's! why are all these lowbies asking questions that don't affect them? why the hell do you have 3 characters when you're main isn't even level 20 yet? you don't have a real character until it's over level 40 (that's where your talent tree kicks in) or 50 for hybrids. but now that i'm done being a typical blackrock man "Blackrock is Full GTFO". Do you want to make money? or have fun with your professions? if you want access to powerful bonuses given by professions choose a crafting profession. Never choose 2 gathering professions unless if you can afford at least 5 16slot bags and one 20 slot dedicated to one of your professions. e.g. Cenarion Herb Bag, Enchanted Runecloth Bag, Miners sack, etc. If you do choose 2 professions, don't choose mining AND herbing, you can only track one... that includes tracking beasts, undead, demons etcetc. Enchanting is both a gathering and a production profession, don't attempt to sell enchants, no one will want them until you're 375 with rare raid only enchants. Selling mats is a good way of making money though, you will recieve a tonne of unwanted items throughtout your characters lifetime, some of these you can AH "of the tiger, of the owl, of the eagle, of the bear, of the beast, of the bandit, of the invoker, of the elders" others will be completely useless "of the whale, of the falcon, of the wolf" here's where enchanting comes in, along with BoP items that you don't want, you can de all of these items and feel good about yourself. if you want to have a fun time leveling and being self sufficient whilst NOT having a money sink, stick with a gathering and a production that you level as you grow, don't switch at all. switching will drain your gold. Herb/Alch, Skin/Leatherworking, Tailor/Skin, Jewel/Mine, Ench/Gathering, Ench/Tailoring, Skin/Gathering, Mine/engineering, Mine/Smith. These are all good professions. and stick with one character. No one likes lowbies. well not on Blackrock, is my personal experience of abuse as a lowbie affecting the way I treat lowbies? never had that problem on Thaurissan... maybe it IS a blackrock thing? yeah... blackrock is so anti-newbies... I can prob go to another server and someone will be nice to newbies... then i'd go back to Blackrock and someone wil be like "GTFO Blackrock is full" and i'll be like THANKYOU! I'm HOME!!! -- - Wolfpaw, Druid @ Blackrock Alliance - Mistpaw, Shaman @ Blackrock Alliance - Marketing, Bank Alt @ Blackrock Alliance 00:34, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Some of the above is good advice, but alot is not. Other people are always leveling lowbie alts so alot of low level items and enchants will be useful even at low levels. If you work on a few professions in combination, 2 gathering professions is fine, especially now that mail between chars on the same server is basically instant. Off topic, please separate messages into paragraphs... one giant chunk of text is painful to read. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 7:58 AM PDT 28 Aug 2007

Flurry and Dual wield

Looking around some wiki pages and thottbot hasn't really explained this well, but how do these two interact? Does flurry last for both weapons for 3 hits per weapon, does it only speed up the main hand weapon, only speed up the weapon that got the crit, or something else? (Hopefully the question made sense.)Minionman 00:37, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Minionman, Flurry only procs for "hits" so any hit you make, increasing both your hands speed until you attack the enemy 5 times (misses, dodges, blocks and parries also count). don't dual wield for flurry, dual wield weapons hit too fast, reducing teh bonus on flurry and lowering the hit chance let alone the crit chance. Moreover flurry achieves much higher dps with a 2H weapon, especially if you can go Arms/Fury, mortal strike crit right after a flurry anyone? proccing flurry again and giving you a large amount of rage to be spent on execute :)

Furthermore, spending talent points to increase your hit rating and improving dual wield is so pointless when you can achieve higher dps through improved rend, and poleaxe mastery (+5% crit with polearms and axes). Imagine +10% crit rating with a polearm or an axe and flurry proccing one after the other?m like the sound of that?

-- - Wolfpaw, Druid @ Blackrock Alliance - Mistpaw, Shaman @ Blackrock Alliance - Marketing, Bank Alt @ Blackrock Alliance 00:09, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Talents in +hit are never wasted in a build that exploits hits. As a rogue (and I know its different) about 50% of my damage is white damage. This is because I do whatever I can to increase my hits. I have a lot of +hit gear as well as haste abilities and gear. This increases not only successful hits, but swings also. Meaning I swing more and more of those swings hit. A d/w shammy with flurry proccing from two weapons would follow the same theory. You cause yourself to have more swings, if you get more hits from those swings you get more damage, and its cheap damage. Also, the only real difference between d/w and 2h weapons is speed. You can hit really hard with a 2hander or hit twice with each weapon in the same amount of time. If you are going to pvp, go for the hard hits, taking the last 1-2000 hp from an opponent is huge in pvp. In pve however, go for the consistent damage that d/w provides. There is a reason rogues top the dps charts with small weapons. More hits = more damage. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 13:21, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Shaman Leveling?

What's a good talent build to level in? meaning each talent point will give me bonuses WHILE leveling, not waiting till i'm 70 for them to become useful. Just like how leveling as a Holy priest is ridiculously painful, all priests go for Spirit Tap, reducing down time between each kill. Similarly what would I require to reduce downtime for a shaman?

Firstly what is our bread and butter? Shocks? Melee? Stormstrike?

To be effective, a shaman must be versitile, so for all you people that say, put all your talents in one tree? you're an idiot. always start off by prioritising! ~ is it better to have mangle at level 51? or reducing the time it takes getting to level 51 and getting mangle at level 61? so for a shaman the question is, do I reduce the cost of my shocks whilst increasing their damage output? or get stormstrike 10 levels earlier? firstly what IS stormstrike? it's well known as the one move that makes shamans so insanely feared in PvP. however... Stormstrike requires dual weilding, dual weilding DECREASES your dps output as any warrior will tell you, Dual Weilding fury warriors have a MUCH lower dps output than a fury warrior using a 2H weapon. why? because 2H weapons do more damage, hit more often, do bigger burst damage and most importantly, when you are leveling a fury warrior, flurry and enrage at level 40 with a 2h weapon (weapon speed > 2.8) will proc every 6 or so hits, flurry procs too often with dual weilding and doesn't give much bonus (-30% for 1.8 atkspd is 1.2, -30% for 3.3atkspd is 2.2, see how much more of a bonus that is?) giving you a dps output of close to 150dps with a good weapon. That's the white damage a level 60 feral cat does.

so what's more important for a shammy that wants the ability to increase mana, decrease mana costs, to be effective in healing gear, and dish out a large amount of dps in dps gear? (I always keep two sets of gear on my characters, one for dps, one for healing, or for tanking) all the while reducing the down time between kills?

On my druid, i went for 11 points in resto before even beginning down the feral tree, giving me Omen of Clarity at level 20, and giving me mangle 10 levels later. Was it worth it? yup, imagine having no down time between kills. In feral cat, i could kill, heal, kill, heal, kill, heal and NOT have to wait for mana. why? every 2nd heal was free due to clearcasting proccing at the end of a battle, and when it wasn't, my dps was so high due to abilities costing me no energy, (again, clearcasting) that I killed fast enough for me not to require healing until I was red, in which case my mana had fully regenerated already.

My question is. Shaman. what talents am I looking for?

-- - Wolfpaw, Druid @ Blackrock Alliance - Mistpaw, Shaman @ Blackrock Alliance - Marketing, Bank Alt @ Blackrock Alliance 00:01, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

You math is off on why flurry would in theory not work well with dual wield. You are correct that each time flurry is set off, there is a shorter time that the attack speed is increased, however, the higher attack rate with the same critical rate gives more times where flurry is set off total, What will happen is that the damage will smooth out because flurry will go off more often but will do less damage when it does. The effect with the biggest chance of slowing flurry down with dual wield is the miss chance (Which may or may not work itself out, other people's opinions will probably be needed for this.), because this reduces the total number of hits in a way that isn't compensated for in flurry.
I can't say much for stormstrike, but I can say that enhancement is a good levelling spec with other talents mainly because, aside from stormstrike uses, it is free damage. You cast a weapon spell (windfury at level 30), and let flurry, thundering strikes, the weapon skill and weapon damage talents, etc. go to work. Totems when soloing don't cost too much mana, the biggest mana users will be shocks, lightning, etc. With an elemental shaman using elemental spells instead of just attacks, you will be using mana a lot unless you want to give up your big investment of damage, with enhancement, you can still do a lot of damage while being low on mana, and in tough fights can use the mana for healing.Minionman 01:25, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

How do i make people trust me site?

Hey there, I am not trying to advertise or something. Recenlty i just created a website for wow players, but seems to me people always think I am a gold spammer/keylogger. And refuse to go to my site. How can i convince people my site is safe? It is a websie that i created jsut for wow players.

-- Egelon 18:07, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Sometimes it just takes time to build up a good reputation. Sometimes word of mouth from others is real helpful. The one thing you really need to think about before you open Yet Another Warcraft Site(tm) is do you offer something that all the other sites don't offer. If the information on your site can be found in 10 other sites that are much more popular, you're not going to get much traffic. If you open up a forum and just say its for WoW players, why should they go there when there's already plenty of other forums out there? I'm not trying to discourage you. When you're dealing with an established game with a huge fanbase that already has a ton of popular sites, you really need to have something different when you open a new site. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 21:36, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
One way to make people think you are not a gold spammer is to not allow gold selling ads on your site. Also, if you don't have any unique or well presented information or features, your site may just not get traffic because there is no motivation for people to visit. Creating a site "just for WoW player" really isn't enough, unfortunately. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 12:01 PM PDT 8 Sep 2007

Steamwheedle Cartel

~I`m FainorTheGreat [ Also known as Necromancer of Dol Guldor ], I`ve would like to join Steamwheedle Cartel US serv, but I didn`t found instructions ... and everytime I tryed to understend some thing in help section I return into deep nothingness ...

~However, I hope that I`ll get some simple help steps to connect Steamwheedle Cartel US serv, ~.~ however, even after this message I`m programming myself to search, find, follow again ... And yeah I also hope I will see the answer message ... Becouse I think there is sort of system of private answers ... Uff, if so I would also like to rescue an E-mail Oo, OFCOURSE if it is possible. If no ... with it, anyway I found this server very good, and would like to join ...

~I also hope this is correct section or I going to be banned for spam /-.-\ probb ... So don`t ban me plz :<, anyway > Thanks for good job you doing here.

~Giant respect to all who working to make this place the best.

~With respect > FainorTheGreat 19:48, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Something in your text makes me think that you are looking for information on how to access private servers which is not supported at all on this site. If you bought the game and have a US account, it should be quite obvious how to join that specific server. --GRYPHONtc 19:54, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
If you weren't talking about private servers and want to join the regular Steamweedle Cartel US server, firstly make sure you have a US account. Then log in and click the "Change Realm" button at the top right of the screen. This will bring up a list of servers. Find the server you wish to join on the list, click to highlight and then click "OK." And you're done. Tyka 07:09, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Druid Quick question on flight form

Does swift flight form replace flight form ( ala Dire Bear ) or do you have 2 flight form buttons?


-- Dga 15:53, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Found out. Yes it does. thanks Nathanyel --Dga 21:17, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Which is kind of uncool...with bear/dire bear, there's really no reason to go back to the old one... but with flight form, if you're hanging out with people who haven't yet collected the 5200 gold for an epic mount, you end up doing a lot of waiting, since you're more than four times as fast as they are... --Azaram 05:15, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes I still have my regular mount for grouping with people who haven't got the 540G to get their epic land mount training yet. I can't imagine how long it will take them to get 5000 spare gold.

"Solo" parties

Noobie here.

I do not own WOW but would like to purchase it and begin playing. The purchase hinges on one issue.

Because of scheduling constraints, i cannot commit (in any meaningful way) to other individuals in a party, with the presumption that each WOW character is played by one individual.

I would like to create 5 characters and play them all (simultaneously)as a group. Can i create/control 5 characters and have them travel/adventure as a party?

I would like to do this because going 'solo' with only one character would lessen the game experience and i would rather control several characters while adventuring.

An older game (Baldurs Gate) had a similar feature...each character had a 'face' icon that could be activated during game play that enabled manipulation of that character...I'd simply activate the different characters during melee to maximise their effect...

hope this makes sence...

any info would be greatly appreciated

bendostoy (—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bendostoy (talkcontr).)

You cannot do it similarly to Baldur's Gate. First of all, you'd need to purchase 5 copies of WoW, and either run 5 instances of WoW on a single computer, one instance on 5 computers or anything in-between. Furthermore, it would be extremely difficult to control five characters, as they will only be effective if you regularly use their abilities. So unless you are an enormously good gamer (and multi-tasker), you'll not be successful with this technique. And I really doubt you'll have fun. --bfx 11:41, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
Levelling in WoW is entirely soloable anyway, so unless you're desperate to go into instances, there's no need to worry. Kirkburn talk contr 14:07, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
Generally, if you want an experience of controlling multiple characters at a time, most MMOs are probably not for you, but you should try it with a trial account just to see, since its free.
Also, if you're desperate to improve your gear beyond solo-able quest rewards, lucky drops, or things you can buy, you can put time into various PvP battlegrounds where the server forms groups automatically (for the most part) and you can earn honor points to purchase decent gear.
You will also find on the higher population servers there really are people on all the time who you can group with and some guilds are very tolerant of occasional casual players as long as you tell them ahead of time. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 11:53 AM PDT 8 Sep 2007
As others have described, compared with other MMOs, going solo in WoW doesn't lessen the experience by much from the beginning all the way to the level cap. Then you can still do non-arena PVP. --Raze 03:15, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Items link is not working

-- Oriannal 19:29, 9 September 2007 (UTC) I'm trying to find out where a certain item is and the link to uncommon items is stuck, I can't get the link to go to the next 200 items. I've tried everything in this box and nothing is working, anyone no what's up.

This stupid Box thing!

Whenever I Input somthing some stupid box comes up. How do I get rid of it?

     -Agamemmnon 23:10 September 9

-- Agamemmnon 03:10, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Like this, you mean?

Make sure that what you're writing does not have a space as the first character. --Azaram 05:20, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Ohhhhh. Thanks. -- Agamemmnon 19:20, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

No problem. Took me a while to figure out too... --Azaram 01:27, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

A new Faction

Am I the only one feeling it but I think there should be a Third or Fourth Faction. Like maybe a Neutral faction that can choose a side of the Horde or Alliance or stay free. FREEMDOM! -Agamemmnon september 10 15:19

Lots of people have suggested this. Here, on the WoW forums, and a million other places. So no, you are not alone. The most common responses are balance and marketability. Two things that take a lot of time and money, as well as huge support from future and current players. Blizzard will only do something like this if they feel it is going to both improve the game and make them enough money to be worth their time. I wouldn't expect it any time soon. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 23:37, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I agree with mucke. If they were to add a third faction they would have to do a lot of work. Imagine all the battlegrounds, what part could a third faction have to do with WSG for example? And then what about quests? Would they use their own? making another couple of hundreds quests would take a lot of man power. I mean they cant exactly use horde and allience quest, exalted with ogrimmar and ironforge? Work that out lore wise. And neutral quests wouldn't suffice. The list just goes on.

A lot of work for something that there really isn't any need for. My guess is that it aint gonna happen.

Illidan's gang would have made a great third faction, I was half expecting them to be before the Burning Crusade was announced. They did not seem villainous at all during The Frozen Throne, just like the Horde or the Alliance trying to survive and make a place for themselves, and just as strong as either factions. Now that this is no longer a possibility, I don't see any chance for a third faction, at least from a lore point of view. -- Raze 01:50, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

In truth I was thinking about maybe a "Neutral" Faction. So maybe it could have five races. Each player can chose which faction they want "Ally" themselves with. Mainly like mercenaries. of course having their own strongholds and such. They could choose which side to fight on before they enter the battleground. Or instead of a new faction they could just be a couple of races not so allied. Ex: Forestrolls- Zul'jin is racial leade, Zul'aman is starting area. Could also be like a level 1-20 area.; Satyrs- Xavius in his tree form as leader. Home could be the various Satyr villages in Felwood or mabey some isles off the coast of Kali.; Pandaren-Their already started as RPG states and they already have a home land that could be added (Most likely will anyway). -Agamemmnon Spetember 18 2007.

Name for twin characters?

I'm got myself a second copy of wow and I'm gonna start multiboxing tomarrow. Gonna play a warlock and priest. I'd like to get matching names for them. I was thinking "tic" and "tac" but it was taken. Doesn't matter if its a name of something real or made up.

-- Ohls 23:05, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

If the priest will be shadow, you could always do something like "Shdaowheal, Shadowkill".
You could pick a name to be shared between them, and make the priest "holy", "healer", etc., and the warlock "Summoner", "Dark", etc. (So, for an example "HealerRalph", and "SummonerRalph" could be the names.)
Something like CheerfulOlderBrother for the priest, and "TwistedYoungerBrother" for the warlock (Which might be taken.) Or something like "OlderPeterson" for one of them and "YoungerPeterson" for the other. (The name can be changed, of course, and brother can be changed to sisterif needed.)Minionman 00:39, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
When I get stuck on names I got to Babel Fish and type in words that represent the idea behind my character. Then translate them into a couple other languages. I do this with a couple different words until I find what I like. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 13:24, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

i need help

well i downloaded WoW and got an account but when i go to click play it says "Failed to find a suitable display device. Exiting program", ive tried goin on WoW forums but i cant get on them either lol can someone pleaes tell me what to do?

Check that it isn't just the installer that you downloaded.Minionman 00:53, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
This could be an incompatible video card or perhaps an unsupported resolution. The fact that you can't get to the official WoW forums makes me wonder what setup you're using. Does you machine even meet the minimum system requirements (see Technology F.A.Q.)? --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 3:04 PM PDT 20 Sep 2007

-_-|| question about main hand and off hand swtiching

-- I want to know how can I make this macro.

first, to judge the main hand or off hand taking a dagger.(Example:main hand holding a dagger and off hand a sword.) then swap main hand with off hand and cast the Sinister Strike. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by S007 (talkcontr). 15:17, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

I use Outfitter mod which has item sets built into it to let me switch from daggers to my fist weapons (and vis versa) when leaving stealth. It can be set up to switch automatically for certain events or you can switch manually with just 2 clicks. This can also be used to switch main hand offhand. I would not recommend switching in combat multiple times. Every time you switch it triggers the global cooldown which means your next special attack will be delayed. So switching between Backstab and Sinister Strike this way would cut down on your DPS. But using it to get an Ambush from stealth and then switching to a different weapon set for after works well for me. Another mod you can use for this is Item Rack. Of the two mods I recommend outfitter as item rack doesn't seem to get updated very often. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 15:37, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

I don't use the Outfitter mod before, I will download it and try to use it.I will advert to the global cooldown solt. But I didn't find that the skill button is black when I use the script macro. The script like this:/script PickupInventoryItem(16) PickupInventoryItem(17). Maybe it is difference between swtiching mainhand to offhand from changing a weapon from the bag. I will try. Thank you very much.

Yes,I find that using the script to swtich mainhand weapon to the offhand don't have the cooldown time. So we can use it. But we must hold a dagger in one hand and a nodagger the other.

Can I make my macro like this?

/cast [noequipped:16,Daggers] Sinister Strike
/script PickupInventoryItem(16) PickupInventoryItem(17)
/cast Sinister Strike

I'm afraid I am not good with macros, which is why I use mods. But, it would seem that you would just keep switching your main hand weapon unless you have a way to tell it to move to your offhand. I would go check out the Macro forums on WoW's site. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 16:37, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

OY, my macro is work. NO cooldown when you swtich weapons. But I get another problem. The gameprogram give me a tip which said your macro is only opened to BLIZZ UI, but the macro is work. I know that the 2.0 version dosen't allow the "/script" sentence. I have saw a article that said about how to shield the error tips. It's just a sentence in the macro. I cann't find that article. I'm looking for it. I'll be very appreciate if you can help me to find out. Thanks.

Epic FlightForm is Fugly :(

so fugly... should be switched around IMO, black crow looks much sexier than that pinyata of a mardi-gra bird that is the Epic Filght Form. It looks like it's just come out of a gaybar... what with all those flamboyant colors and what not, it's just screaming seediness.-- - Wolfpaw, Druid @ Blackrock Alliance - Mistpaw 23:41, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

I could be wrong, but negative comments about sexual preference may be frowned upon. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 00:29, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
They are.--SWM2448 00:59, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
Instead, say this: "This bird has color combinations that were never meant to see the light of day!" ~ Doc Lithius [U|T|C] 11:32, 21 September 2007 (UTC)


Moved from Village Pump. --Fandyllic (talk · contr)

So I've heard that terrokkar only has enough quests to get you one level (To 64) and I'm still 6 bars from 63, and I ran out of zangarmarsh quests! What should I do?

-- Zimmy 20:39, 14 September 2007 (UTC) Zimmy

I think this comment is probably in the wrong place, since this is the village pump for WoWWiki and not the Warcraft Pump, but I'll see if I can't help out.

Try either some instances, like Blood Furnace, Ramparts, or some of the Coilfang Reservoir instances. You could also see if there are quests available in Nagrand. Also, make sure you have gotten all the Zangarmarsh quests, check and make sure you have them all from the Cenarion Refuge, Telredor, and the Orebor Harborage. I think there are even some in the Spawning Glen. Going back and making sure you have everything done from Hellfire Penninsula would help.

If none of that works, there is always Grinding.

-- Dirkbronze 21:16, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

I believe I entered Terrokar at 64 and left at 66. During that time I did 3 maybe 4 dungeons. Without rested xp I was getting about 2 levels each zone, and I did every quest and about 2-4 dungeon runs each zone. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 00:28, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
Have you been to the Orebor Harborage in northwest Zangarmarsh? The Kurenai there have several level 64 quests. There are also several quests from the Sporeggar town after you have gained at least friendly reputation from doing quests from Fahssn in the southwest just east of the Spawning Glen.
Also, in Terokkar Forest there should be several quests in Allerian Stronghold or Stonebreaker Hold as well as a few extra quests at Stonebreaker Camp east of Stonebreaker Hold or Allerian Post northeast of Allerian Stronghold. I'm assuming you've done all the Refugee Caravan quests you could do? Eventually you should also do the Sha'tari Base Camp quests on the southwest side of Bone Wastes.
Somehow I don't think you've explored enough. There are many, many quests. I've never had to grind really, have done only a few instance runs and I've gotten 3 characters to level 70. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 5:37 PM PDT 17 Sep 2007
There are a few more quests on the east side of the Bone Wastes, as well. Look for a Draenei with several wounded ones by a big rock, facing the forest full of spiders. I was 67 when I left Terrokar, and finished the last three in Blade's Edge Mountains, mostly; did a few in Nagrand to help a friend. Mostly, I wanted to save them for once I hit 70, for the extra cash for quests at the level cap. --Azaram 06:07, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

does jewelcrafting have a complementary profession?

for example does it need mining?

-- Cweetiepie 11:25, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Jewelcrafting gets most of its materials from mining. The various rings, neck pieces and such all take some type of metal bars to create. You get gems from mining which are a must for the profession. Also you can Prospect ore to get gems. So, yes, I would say you need to have access to a miner, be a miner, or have lots of gold to buy materials if you are going to be a jewelcrafter. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 16:34, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

(RESOLVED) Common, Rare, Elite, and Rare-Elite Hunter Pets

I have a real simple question about Hunter pets. Basically, I want to know if there's any solid data backing up the theory that Rare, Elite, and Rare-Elite tamable pets have greater base stats than "common" pets. For example, if one hunter were to tame Gutripper while another simply tamed an Avian Ripper, would there be any noticable difference to either pet aside from coloration? ~ Doc Lithius [U|T|C] 03:28, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

I believe the base stats are all the same. What you get by training rare and named mobs are their special abilities. From these mobs you often get a higher rank of the various abilities than a "normal" mob. Also, you get bragging rights for taming something that is more difficult to tame. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 14:03, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
The base stats are all the same for creatures in the same family at the same level. A strigid owl that you leveled from 5 to 67 will have the same base stats as Guttripper would have at level 67. The big difference are the pet skills. Gutripper already comes with Claw 9 and Screech 5. If you tamed the Avian Ripper, it wouldn't come with those skills and you'd have to train them yourself. See Petopia for all your hunter pet needs. - ClydeJr - talk - contrib 16:23, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
Sweet... Thanks for clearing this up for me! ~ Doc Lithius [U|T|C] 23:15, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Zep above Orgrimmar

If you look up when in the main valley in Org near the bank and such you see a single stationary Zep way above the town. Anyone know what this is about? Hooper 18:29, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Just to make the city look more complex and bustleing. Scenery.--SWM2448 19:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

What level is needed to use a portal to Shattrath?

See title. I'm interested both because I have an enchanting character that will likely want to go there for training, and out of curiosity to see what it looks like. I will not be making the portal, just using it to go there. Also, are all city services usable while there at a lower level, or is there some limit?Minionman 03:22, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

I took my lvl 35 to shatt for just that very reason. Just get a mage port, or warlock summon and you are set. I have also had my hearthstone set there since then. Makes it easy to get back and train more enchants as well as get to all parts of the old world much more quickly. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 07:19, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
I personally have seen level 5s in Shattrath, so they were either portaled or summoned there. I'd be willing to bet that Shattrath now has the most hearthstones set in either of the worlds... As long as you're not a belf or space-blueberry, you shouldn't have any trouble at all; if you are one of those, stay out of the Aldor/Scryer areas, respectively, as you start unfriendly with the opposing race's faction. I think everything else is open, otherwise. --Azaram 09:45, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

The ultimate battle of ultimate destiny

Whats the most powerfull thing in all of the RPGs and warcraft universe? For that matter, whats the most powefull thing in-game? And nobody say saurfang.-- Cormundo 22:32, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Illidan's probably the most powerful thing stat wise and ability wise in the game right now. In the warcraft universe, who knows.Minionman 00:05, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
U sure its not kelthuzad because he needs a 40 man raid of 60s, wich is like 30 70s? Cormundo 04:23, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
More like 10-15 70s. Ony has been downed with i believe 3 60s pre-TBC and she's been 5 manned by 70s quite regulary since, and she was a 40 mad raid. Currently in-game it is probably Illidan. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 14:36, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
She? Who are you talking about? --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 5:47 PM PDT 24 Sep 2007
Ony = Onyxia. Read the post. Drek'thar has the highest player kill count. Lore-wise I would say the Old Gods at their best.--SWM2448 01:10, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Indeed. Illdian kicks ass. Now, speaking of ass kicking, whats prolly gonna be the most powerful thing coming? Also whats the most powerfull:

  • pet
  • Hunter weps and armor
  • warrior weps and armor
  • mage weps and armor
  • warlock weps and armor
  • shaman weps and armor
  • rogue weps and armor
  • paladin weps and armor
  • lol...Death knight weps and armor if we had death kinghts.
  • city
  • biggest city
  • biggest creture in game
  • zone
  • biggest zone
  • Murloc
  • elemental
  • boss
  • boss (city)
  • lore-wise charecter other than titans or old gods
  • giant
  • titan
  • beast
  • undead
  • dragon
  • continent
  • Most expensive item
  • most killed NPC and/or mob?

and a lot more, Ill add more when I remeber.

Please let it be noted that I am not just trawling for info, I just would like to put up the notes on these thing individual pages, and of course, I love warcraft and wowwiki so Freakin MUCH!!! I <3 WOWWIKI! Cormundo 10:53, 25 September 2007 (UTC) Frostmourn? FROSTMOURN?!? NOBODY CARES ABOUT FROSTMOURNE! WE WANT THE ASHBRINGER!!!!! 22:39, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

wait...3 60s?!? Cormundo 10:54, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

The Video --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 16:09, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Ony wasnt downed. They dropped her health 2%, not got her to 2%, lol. I actualy think that represnts perefctly my desire for old stuff heroics. Cormundo 20:11, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Im pretty sure at this point the most poweful pet are those nightsabers up in skettis. Happy taurens come from TB 22:47, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Most poweful continent looks like easten kingdoms. More power. Happy taurens come from TB 23:37, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

They did kill her...that was part one of 3.--BlameMe Mucke talkTo 05:10, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

GM Section

Is there a GM Section on this Wiki that ive totaly missed? if there isnt then what chance one can be put together? id contribute to it ofcourse. its just i wanna see what i can learn from other GM's. -- KingStoph 15:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Guild masters? The guild page, surely. Kirkburn talk contr 15:48, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
He either means Guild Master or Game Master. By the context, I can assume he means Guild Master, though. ~ Doc Lithius [U|T|C] 16:06, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
I mean Game Master --KingStoph 17:10, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
In that case, no. We do not support such activities. Kirkburn talk contr 17:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
What activities? is there ment to be some uber secret code about it? coz half of the GM Codes are posted in a few places...? --KingStoph 18:55, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Eh? We don't support emulated servers, nor should we carry info about how to use them. Kirkburn talk contr 19:26, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
I said nothing about emulated servers... im on about a Section for GM's. about GM Commands and the such --KingStoph 19:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
About what things GMs can do? All that we can carry is on Game Master. The intricacies of their job and their specific methods are not our business. Kirkburn talk contr 19:44, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
We have already been warned by Blizzard in the past about putting exploit information in WoWWiki. Any info about GM secret codes sounds like exploit info to me. Just because other sites have this info doesn't make it non-exploit. If you can explain why the information you want wouldn't or couldn't be interpreted by Blizzard as exploit info, then maybe we'll add it. However, until you give a reasonable explanation, WoWWiki can't encourage, endorse, or participate in adding potential exploit info, if we want to remain in relatively good standing with Blizzard. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 5:40 PM PDT 24 Sep 2007
We have one? Neat!--SWM2448 00:45, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
You cant use the Codes unless your a GM, so its impossible to exploit them. so therefore cant realy be labeled as an Exploit. --KingStoph 08:44, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
Well, if you can only use the codes as a GM, why put them in WoWWiki? This is not a resource for Blizzard employees. I'm sure they have their own. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 10:15 AM PDT 25 Sep 2007


Heroics for everything? Also, all outland heroics upgraded in new Xpasnsion? Heroic everything? -- Cormundo 11:07, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Haven't heard anything too definitive on that. I did run across a Q&A with one of the developers at Blizzcon. He said that old content was old content and they felt it was more important to spend time on new stuff rather than revamping old stuff. I believe this was referring to flying mounts in Azeroth but I can't recall for sure, and of course I can't seem to find the video again :(. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 16:15, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
Personally, I find the idea of heroic versions as lazy and uninteresting, albeit challenging for the player. It reminds me of games with bad AI just making the enemies to cheat (super fast regen, shooting through walls, teleporting from place to place, etc.) to make the game harder. I think the only reason people like heroics is because the drop rates are better. WoW sadly is sometimes all about the gear. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 2:21 PM PDT 25 Sep 2007

The reason I want the heroics is so someone will go with me into dangol AQ!What about the lore! What about the lore! Nobody wants a lore person exept those insane RPers. Frostmourn? FROSTMOURN?!? NOBODY CARES ABOUT FROSTMOURNE! WE WANT THE ASHBRINGER!!!!! 21:50, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

[OFF-TOPIC] If that's a signature, it's an excessively long one... ~ Doc Lithius [U|T|C] 01:27, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
There is also an E at the end of Frostmourne. :P --SWM2448 02:06, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Ahem...BAH! Spelling is fur yu Fraotmourn wantirs! Frostmourn? FROSTMOURN?!? NOBODY CARES ABOUT FROSTMOURNE! WE WANT THE ASHBRINGER!!!!! 03:06, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

How about Happy taurens come from TB 03:09, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Cormundo - this site is not intended as a forum. Talk pages are intended for discussion of the main articles, not whatever random comment pops into your head. (This page is slightly different). Kirkburn talk contr 04:56, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Sorry :P wont do that anymore. Happy taurens come from TB 22:45, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

[OFF-TOPIC] I like your new sig better Cormundo. --Fandyllic (talk · contr) 4:56 PM PDT 26 Sep 2007

Err...I know Im not supposed to do these off topic ones, but I cant take a compliment with out saying thank you, so thank you so much. Happy taurens come from TB 01:57, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Warcraft III The Frozen Throne's custom Campaign

I have got a problem whit WC3. There is an option named Custom campaign. Is it used to create campaigns? There is only Exodus of the Horde campaign. There is nothing else! Kapteeni40 has spoken. 22:52, 25 September 2007

Yes it is used to create campaigns.Minionman 13:49, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Keyboard language settings change during the game


Occasionally my keyboard language settings seem to change during the game. The result of this is that when I i.e. press - the game will use / etc.

I suspect this is caused by me accidently hitting a specific key combination. The annoying thing is I have no idea which combination and therefore cannot reverse the proces.

Does anyone have any idea why this happens or which keycombo i hit?

-- Hyrakles 00:41, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

In Windows XP, pressing left-alt and shift simultaneously changes the keyboard language settings; you might need to press it twice or more often, in case you have multiple languages in your list. This key combination can be changed via control panel > Date, Time, Language, and Regional Options. --bfx 08:20, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

WC3's Custom Campaign option 2

I meaned how it is used?

Web Based Tutorial This is a third party website that is supposed to be helpful, best I can do. --BlameMe Mucke talkTo 20:41, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Is WoW Wiki going to consider the novels Canon now?

I've noticed that WoW Wiki doesn't seem to accept the novels as part of the Warcraft universe. I kinda find that odd especially since trying to use Names from the Novels such as Brox or Rhonnin are refused if you try to use them in the game when creating a new character, same as the more well-known character names such as Arthas, Illidan or Thrall. But now that it's been officially announced that Rhonin will not only be appearing in the up-coming expansion pack Wrath of the Lich King, but will be a faction leader (Apparently the new leader of the Kirin Tor/Dalaran) will WoW Wiki allow novel Characters and info on the site? If so I'd be glad to help add the information as I own virtually every Warcraft novel published to date :D

Altho I have 2 admit I'm biased in that, apart from Khadgar, Medivh and Sylvanas (both Elf and Undead) all my fav Warcraft Characters are from the novels :P

-- Bobthekillercow 14:24, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

I'd advise researching us a bit more. You will find that every novel and most novel characters have their own pages here, which link to other relevent pages. Novel characters appear on in-universe lists. We don't consider the novels not part of the Warcraft universe, we just tag any lore that turns up in one source only. It's a policy that was developed to keep track of RPG-only lore, and then branched into tagging other media.
NOTICE: Medivh has been part of the lore since the beginning, Khadgar was introduced in WCII, and Sylvanas in WCIII, so they aren't from novels by any means.--Ragestorm (talk · contr) 17:41, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
He did say that "apart from" those characters, all of his favorite characters are from the novels. That would exclude the three he listed! -- Cynra (T·C) 17:52, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Community content is available under CC-BY-SA unless otherwise noted.