This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Morogrim Tidewalker article.

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Nihilum Kill on 7th or 8th?

Although on Nihilum's website the news posts reads the 8th it was only the 7th of March at the time in the United States, even EST, so I'm not sure if the kill should be recorded as being on the 8th or 7th. --321 22:03, 7 March 2007 (EST)

would like to say the whole world does not revolve around the USA, the date of the first kill, is the date of the timezone the first kill was made in —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Js1006 (talkcontr).

Just because the world doesn't revolve around us doesn't mean we aren't the best, anonomous. Take that!!!!!! Mr.X8 00:59, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, sure... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Thundor (talkcontr).

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, just have the courage to say whos it it. And Nihilum is a European guild. Mr.X8 22:23, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

New Here

the red bar says the tactics have been copied and pasted, they have NOT. I typed up the tactics my guild successfully uses everytime we kill Morogrim, perhaps they are similar due to the fact the tactics we used were developed from advice we were given, but everthing i typed is orginal to me —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Js1006 (talkcontr).

Tanking 'tip'

Does it really make sense to rehash the advantages/disadvantages of the different tanking classes here? Should we not call it sufficient to link to Tank (or some other relevant article) and describe the earthquake ability, and what new limitations it applies to particular classes abilities? Hrocdol 17:48, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

I removed all the squabble over tanking. I agree that a strategy page isn't a place for it. Manan 11:47, 15 October 2007

You also removed the only part that mentions that earthquake has some sort of knockdown effect, so I included that removed part in italics below. It's still not clear to me why he would be able to hit the tank 6 times in 5 seconds. Some of this should definitely be merged back into the article, at least the effect of earthquake should be clarified. Tifi 16:25, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

It is beneficial to use a druid MT for Morogrim, despite the crushing blows. Rationale? With earthquake, a protection warrior WILL eat crushings. Guaranteed. Occasionally, s/he'll eat back-to-back crushing blows. This is *not* due to lack of skill or lack of shield block % or anything. This is due to the simple fact that Morogrim can eat up both of your shield block charges and then hit you 4x before the cooldown is up.

And yes, druids eat crushing blows. Quite a few of them. However, a druid will take much less damage from each hit than a warrior; many wipes may result from the massive amount of burst damage this boss does.

Remember: a crushing blow is still mitigated by armor. And a 35k maxed out 75% reduction feral druid is going to take a *lot* less damage from a crushing blow than a protection warrior. Enough that it makes sense to have one tanking it.

The above statements are not totally accurate. The rate of crushing blows on most Warrior MTs on this fight is fairly low as long as the tank keeps shield block up, and has a decent amount of base dodge/block/parry for when the shield block charges are consumed. Like most of the early 25 man raids, this fight is more conducive to high mitigation compared to stamina stacking. Keep in mind that even if you have Shield Block activated, and you dodge, parry or the boss misses you, it will not consume a charge of Shield Block which will enable you to save these charges for later. In addition, the stun he does is not considered a true "stun" where you cannot block dodge or parry during its duration. It is more of an interrupt effect in the sense that you can still move or use your abilities during the stun, but it will interrupt any currently casting spells. (Much like the "stun" ogre NPCs will use on you)
It should also be noted that a geared Paladin Tank on this boss will never face either problem and generally takes significantly less burst damage than Feral Druids, or Protection Warriors, due to having 8 charges on Holy Shield and generally requires less luck to maintain those charges before/during/after Earthquake.
Whilst taking Ironshield Potions the most damage a Protection Paladin would take would be around 4k/swing, with blocked lows of 2.9k, and a maximum theoretical of 5.6k*, typically they're the easiest tank to heal because they take the least variation in damage(*Assumes 17.4k armour self-buffed).
If I'm correct, both the Tidal Wave and Earthquake can consume Shield Block charges. I suppose he can hit you 6 times in 5 seconds if he did a Tidal Wave, then an Earthquake right afterwards, just as you Shield Walled, and then everything was parried, thus increasing his next attacks, but even then I don't think it will account for 6 hits. It's a general rule, though, that Morogrim can tend to do a great burst of damage onto a tank at any time, and it isn't suprising if you don't one shot him every single time even after he is on farm. After reading this article after being reduced, it seems TOO reduced and doesn't appear to effectively explain the fight. I think it needs some modifying if anyone can contribute more detail. --Furi, January 03, 2008.
This page should certainly include the discussion about the different tanks, as it is very essential that raids know what tank to use. As it is, this page contains no mention of warning against using Warriors as main tanks in this fight, which is a bit disastrous considering the numerous ways he can eat up shield block charges. Druids have been generally acknowledged as the best tank to use for this fight, with high armor to mitigate the string of crushing blows that will eventually come. I would not know how effective Holy Shield fares against him, but Paladin tanks would be much more suited to tanking the murloc adds rather than the boss. Considering that paladins don't have any significant advantages over druids, it wouldn't make much sense to have the AoE specialist tank a single mob. Pzychotix (talk · contr) 14:14, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
I'm beginning to agree. Under Tactics a paragraph on tanking sounds appropriate and easily is a factor of this fight. I do think that reducing the previous tanking tactics was beneficial, though. Perhaps add notes on each tank, but not as elongated as before. Simply state the pros and cons that normally each tank isn't faced against by bosses. I also noted that Amplify Magic has been advised. Will this increase the damage from the Watery Graves? My raid has once questioned placing this buff on the MT (a warrior), but was against increasing Tidal Wave's damage. Overall, I suppose the buff would be better, on at least the AoEing classes, though if Murlocs get onto you, nothing close to 200 extra healing will save you. The article repeats a few tips and also.. fails to go into detail on different aspects. Again, this article definitely needs some editting and contributing. --Furi, January 05, 2008.

Enrage Timer

What's the enrage timer on this guy? Stillfresh 19:15, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

There is either none, or it is set comfortably high. My guild beat him for the first time tonight in just under 15 minutes. JIM 11:05, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

6 hits in 5 seconds

According to my combat log, Morogrim's swing timer, in instances where he is not parrying, seems to vary from .5s to 2s, with occasional back to back attacks, which can result in 6 attacks in 5 seconds, disregarding parries. A warrior tank will be taking a number of crushing blows on this fight, regardless of skill. The spike damage sequence will generally be a 4.5k hit, 4.5k hit, 6k crush (numbers will vary by armor, of course) over the course of ~2 seconds.

Now, a druid tank will also take damage spikes. These will generally be a string of three crushes for about 4.5k each. The main difference is that this is much less likely than a warrior's spike damage (about 10% the chance, assuming the warrior has roughly 50% avoidance). However, the druid will be eating more damage from Earthquake and Tidal Wave (as neither is mitigated by armor).

Flowers 17:02, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

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