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(This is a dead topic, Please do not edit this page!)

Update: see #It begins!, below.

Good morning!

So, as you may have heard, the Cataclysm beta is gearing up, and could arrive as soon as late next week! Additionally, there will be no NDA - the NDA only applies during the alpha period, which has a very limited number of participants and isn't open to the public. If past experience is any guide, it shouldn't be too long until we start getting keys to hand out. At the moment I do not know how many, however.

If all goes well, I should be reporting from the beta as a representative of both WoWWiki and Wikia - I've been meaning to get back into WoWWiki properly for a while, and running around the Lost Isles taking hundreds of screenshots should be fun :P

As we get ready for the beta, are there requests of specific stuff we should be looking out for? Screenshotting world changes and recording the events of the new starting zones seems like a natural starting point, but what other areas are there to focus on?

Kirkburn  talk  contr 15:22, April 8, 2010 (UTC)

Focus on Zalashji ... that dang naga better do something =P User:Coobra/Sig4 17:00, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
Hell yeah, exploring lesser known places sounds like a great idea. Kirkburn  talk  contr 17:30, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
Zalashji is not in his cave anymore.... the subzone still exists, but his cave has collapsed. currently =( User:Coobra/Sig4 18:57, July 31, 2010 (UTC)

Any screenshots we take should probably be flagged/stubbed, so that we can go back and verify that the screenshot remains accurate in the release version, no? There might well be landscaping going on during the beta period.

Most everything else (items, quests, mechanics changes) can be flagged Stub/PTR, can't they? But how do you distinguish Cataclysm changes ("version changes") from the next set of major or minor patch changes? --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 20:45, April 8, 2010 (UTC)

Offhand, build # comes to mind as it changes with every major/minor patch. But that would require a change to Stub/PTR to accept a 2nd set of numbers as patch # would be 4.0 (4.0.x?), and the build number would be the thing that changes with every patch. Or, create Stub/Cata like Stub/PTR, and just have the template accept a build #. Resa1983 (talk) 20:52, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
We can reappropriate {{Stub/Cataclysm}} for this. With a note that "content posted comes from the beta, but may be different upon release" or something similar --k_d3 20:54, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
Aye, creating a "beta" stub I believe is something we've done before. What we could do is request images are tagged with the beta build number [edit: as Resa1983 says] [editedit: as Kd3 says!] ... but tbh I wouldn't expect major changes between beta builds to a single area - it will likely be an entire zone being rolled out, or specific cases of changes (like Vrykul getting a new model, Kaskala being trashed). Once we're live (or close to release), we could check the images haven't changed and remove the tags. If they have changed, we can archive them and get new ones.
This, coming from someone who obsessively checks changes over time to all sorts of stuff. I find it fascinating. Kirkburn  talk  contr 20:55, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
PS: Quick related note - I have no specific news on BlizzCon 2010 yet. Kirkburn  talk  contr 21:02, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
Something like {{Cataclysm/Image}}? Just created it, but not sure how much detail you'd like in it. User:Coobra/Sig4 23:32, April 8, 2010 (UTC)
I threw {{Cataclysm/Image}} into the licensing options for easy access and allow beta testers to choose the correct one from the get go... as such I placed it at the very top. User:Coobra/Sig4 01:51, April 9, 2010 (UTC)
Good stuff :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 14:13, April 9, 2010 (UTC)

Cataclysm alpha

Yes, everyone knows it's running, and some websites are now carrying (many!) screenshots of the alpha. Until Blizzard tells us otherwise, we shouldn't post them - as they are under NDA, and they risk our position as an official fansite.

We may want to add to MediaWiki:Sitenotice and MediaWiki:Anonnotice to help deal with problems? Kirkburn  talk  contr 17:35, May 6, 2010 (UTC)

If you want to. It may help.--SWM2448 17:48, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
Something like this? --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 18:10, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
Needs more blinking text. --User:Gourra/Sig2 18:16, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
I don't touch no blinkin' text. ... even if I might be tempted in this case. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 19:00, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
I would suggest a lock on all Cataclysm-related pages, all zones that will be changed, so forth, as most of the edits seem to be coming from people who registered because "ooh, MMO-Champ is posting screenies". Say, people who haven't been registered for longer than a month can't edit these pages, or something like that. --Joshmaul (talk) 21:55, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
I preemptively put comments saying not to add alpha stuff on all those pages. I suppose it was a bit too optimistic of me to assume it would work. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 22:15, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
Doesn't Wikipedia (and hopefully, by extension, most other wikis) have something where they can make certain pages semi-protected (unable to be edited by the newly-registered)? --Joshmaul (talk) 00:41, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
We have one for new users younger than 4 days... I asked kd3 if we can get a longer period. User:Coobra/Sig4 00:49, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Certain pages like Deathwing and Cataclysm have already been thusly protected, but since the expansion is affecting everything we'd have to protect the entire wiki to really make sure and I don't think that's feasible. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:49, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Well, the alpha won't last a great deal of time... so in some weeks it won't matter. User:Coobra/Sig4 00:51, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Guess it's just a matter of being vigilant, then. Now if only I could delete NDA-violating images myself... -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:53, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Well thanks to KD3, we at least have a warning added to that new gallery addition feature to tells people not to upload alpha screenshots... that should halt a majority of the people from doing it. User:Coobra/Sig4 00:56, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
What exactly is the difference between a Beta testing and Alpha testing anyways?AhotahThunderhorn (talk) 03:34, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
As far as internal usage goes, it signifies different stages of completion. As far as external testing, where Blizzard's concerned the difference is in A) scope (alpha is only for friends and family members of Blizzard employees and beta is for a larger pool of testers) and B) the alpha is under a Non-Disclosure Agreement and the beta isn't. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 03:44, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Alpha is for making sure most of the code works, and Beta is for stress testing out problems that only show up on a larger scale and over time, like a watch that is a fraction of a millisecond off will not start to tell time wrong until enough time has passed for those fractions of milliseconds to add up, if I remember right.Gizmonomicon 05:09, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
For more information, see -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 05:48, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
I made something more bliking out of Erik's page: User:Eirik Ratcatcher/Sandbox
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 06:58, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Awesome :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 11:52, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
I got a message from Blizz late last night, thanking us for not posting alpha stuff: "we wanted to extend our thanks to everyone for sticking with us and being so supportive of not posting or leaking content. We know this isn’t easy and understand the frustrations some of you may be experiencing, but we have plans to help with this and will be getting back to you as soon as possible with more details on those plans." Kirkburn  talk  contr 11:56, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
Alpha keys? ;0 --Sky (t · c) 18:04, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
A pony? ... with saddle bags that act as a bank? ... with attachable wagon for extra passengers? User:Coobra/Sig4 18:06, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
No thanks, I've already got a pony. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 18:26, May 7, 2010 (UTC)
I just want you to know that we all think that was terrible :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 21:58, May 8, 2010 (UTC)
Can we comment out that blinkynessnessness ... killing my eyes. User:Coobra/Sig4 19:17, May 9, 2010 (UTC)

Does it count as violating the NDA if I were to talk about on the changes between other users such as on the lore forums?AhotahThunderhorn (talk) 12:25, May 10, 2010 (UTC)

If you're talking about Blizzard's forums, that's up to them; we're not affiliated with Blizzard in any way so we can't really give a solid answer on that. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 17:30, May 10, 2010 (UTC)
Sounds like he's talking about the wowwiki lore forum. And... It makes me nervous. For instance, talking about what you found on mmochampion would probably be acceptable, but talking about what you found in the alpha would not. Proving the difference is almost certain to be more trouble than it is worth. And it's a very short step between talking about alpha stuff and actually posting alpha material. I'd be a lot more comfortable if such discussions waited until Beta started. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 18:58, May 10, 2010 (UTC)
KISADTAA. User:Coobra/Sig4 19:02, May 10, 2010 (UTC)
I fear you will need to be more explicit. Google was unable to enlighten me. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 19:25, May 10, 2010 (UTC)
Oh.. right, sry. Keep It Simple And Don't Talk About Alpha - KISADTAA. =P User:Coobra/Sig4 19:32, May 10, 2010 (UTC)
Fair enough, I'm a team player so I won't do or say anything that goes against anyone's wishes...especially if it's a deadly viper.
P.S. - I have a major idea for WoWwiki I've been considering that I'll be posting on the forums soon, maybe even later tonight. ;]AhotahThunderhorn (talk) 20:37, May 10, 2010 (UTC)

Dealing with the changes

I think we all recognise this is going to be a major issue with Cataclysm, given the extent of the changes we've seen so far. I'm starting a topic on the policy forum about it - Forum:Cataclysm changes Kirkburn  talk  contr 19:56, May 13, 2010 (UTC)

It begins!

The beta has begun. I have not had any specific communication from Blizzard at this point, I will let you know as soon as I have. Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:00, June 30, 2010 (UTC)

Okay now I've had communication. Invites "soon". Request to refrain from posting alpha content as it's not as 'current' and 'shiny' as beta. I would interpret that as avoiding obviously unfinished stuff, but I think general finished changes - expecially information, not photos - are fair game. Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:03, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
Oh, also, I'm in Poland on a laptop until Sunday. Of all the times... Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:03, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
That's too bad Kirkburn.... ... .... /me holds out hand Tongueout User:Coobra/Sig4 23:08, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
Hopefully it won't be long before I will have invites to hand out. In related news I should have one or two BlizzCon tickets. Once I get more news from Blizz, you'll hear about it. Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:21, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
One or two tickets? Geez, they're skimping more every year. --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 03:09, July 1, 2010 (UTC)

Note, Help:Updating for Cataclysm needs updating now the NDA is lifted. Great page though, thanks to those who wrote it! (Off to bed now). Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:25, June 30, 2010 (UTC)

While Zarhym confirmed that the NDA is indeed lifted, he also added, "Bear in mind that the EULA still prevents reverse-engineering or otherwise data-mining of the Cataclysm beta client. Linking to or sharing data-mined information is a violation of the forum Code of Conduct. Essentially, anything that testers can't access via beta gameplay shouldn't be posted on the forums." How much of this applies here is likely a matter of debate. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:15, July 1, 2010 (UTC)
My mass import of what I've had waiting is done. See User:Kaydeethree#Current projects for what got imported (mainly quests and quest-related items/rewards) --k_d3 00:18, July 1, 2010 (UTC)
Incidentally, I think Zarhym's point is a good corollary to our own DNP policy. --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 03:07, July 1, 2010 (UTC)

Indeed. What Zarhym's posted is basically my stance on datamining. --k_d3 03:11, July 1, 2010 (UTC)
It's generally been my rule of thumb as well. Just reiterating it. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 03:25, July 1, 2010 (UTC)
Nice work kd3! Kirkburn  talk  contr 11:34, July 1, 2010 (UTC)

*taps foot* Feels like being left out compared to last beta... Maybe they don't even feel like giving us beta keys this time. --User:Gourra/Sig2 13:44, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Mmm, we got our beta keys about a week after WotLK beta started, we still have another day or two before we can really start moaning. --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 13:49, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Really? I must have not noticed that. --User:Gourra/Sig2 14:14, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
You think for making sure we kept everything alpha related off here... we'd be first in line to be able to keep datamined info off during beta... User:Coobra/Sig4 14:17, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
I'm still being told "soon". Kirkburn  talk  contr 16:35, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Shame it's not too soon. lol =P User:Coobra/Sig4 16:44, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Did someone say, 'soon'? (Obligatory.) --Sky (t · c) 17:52, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
I am not prepared for the shock of when I actually get my beta key :) On that note, I've got a status note on User:Kirkburn, so no need to prod me. Kirkburn  talk  contr 18:06, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
I got my Beta key. :) It's nice being press. ;D Elüna talk / contr     20:09, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
I'm press too ... *cry* Kirkburn  talk  contr 20:57, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
That's weird... --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 23:17, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

The "soon" update was sent as a mass mail not long after the US was back at work today - so I'm betting I'm not the only one who had an email in her inbox :P Kirkburn  talk  contr 01:09, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
You have a sex change while you were gone? User:Coobra/Sig4 02:55, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
He is talking about Neth, his contact at Blizzard. Yay stray pronouns. --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 03:31, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

Now I just get to sit and wait for them to pick me in one of their random invite waves. Meanwhile, my friends who've stopped playing got theirs first. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 03:43, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
Yep... got to love the randomness of the system. User:Coobra/Sig4 03:44, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
You'd expect us important people (read: admins) to get the beta keys first first... Hrmph. --User:Gourra/Sig2 08:52, July 8, 2010 (UTC)
I'm not admin here, only over at WoWRP. Hurts me that I'm not admin here too. BUT then again, at least I have a beta key! Oh, funny thing happened yesterday. HQ at work got a mail about adding employees to the VIP queue for the beta, so I added my staff to it. Elüna talk · contr     09:00, July 8, 2010 (UTC)
Indent heaven. I've got my key finally, planning on taking loads of screenshots. I'll let ya'll know when I get news on more keys. Kirkburn  talk  contr 16:52, July 8, 2010 (UTC)
I'm a lousy cook, and have only moderate impulse control. When I'm offered excellent Pot Roast, I generally fill up on that. I can always get Ice Cream later. Look me up after I've ground out another 60 or so Pristine Black Diamonds... --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 20:15, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Uploading screenshots

Anyone got a suggestion for a good way for me to share masses of zone screenshots? I'm considering Picasa. Kirkburn  talk  contr 22:50, July 9, 2010 (UTC)

Special:MultipleUpload - or Flickr since we can import easily from there. --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 22:55, July 9, 2010 (UTC) Couldn't we create a list of images that need to be taken a screen shot of? Elüna talk · contr     08:53, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

I'm uploading them here - trying to anyway. List of new files here. Not adding them to articles personally atm, just want to get them online. No qualms about people editing or deleting them as necessary. Kirkburn  talk  contr 16:54, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Okay, first batch are up. Wide range of stuff, I've labelled most with subzones. I've more from the Gilneas and Lost Isles zones, which I'll sort through soon. Back to my human hunter first, methinks... Kirkburn  talk  contr 19:37, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
Bit delayed on getting the rest of my screenshots up unfortunately. I'm in Poland for a week (with Wikia), but should be able to do a whole bunch as soon as I'm back. Kirkburn  talk  contr 13:41, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Beta keys incoming

Attention all active admins, get in contact with me if you need a beta key (if know you my email do that, or Special:EmailUser/Kirkburn me). Keys are limited within reason. Apologies this is a little late, seems we had a bit of miscommunication with Blizz. Kirkburn  talk  contr 15:26, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

Does Blizzard - or wowwiki - have particular goals in mind for these beta keys? --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 21:59, July 20, 2010 (UTC)
Step 1 - Give out Beta keys
Step 2 - ???
Step 3 - Profit
-- User:Coobra/Sig4 22:07, July 20, 2010 (UTC)
Skip to step three: Profit. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 22:43, July 20, 2010 (UTC)
More seriously, for WoWWiki it helps us cover and detail the features and changes in Cataclysm :) Blizzard gets favourable publicity and bug testing out of it. Kirkburn  talk  contr 08:18, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
I read detail as derail there the first time... >.>--k_d3 08:20, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
Nah, that's what the beta forums are for :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 12:44, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

Kd3, myself, Sky, pcj, Gourra and Coobra have or are in line for keys atm. Kirkburn  talk  contr 16:32, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

What about loyal editors wondering why Blizzard's giving them the shaft? *grin* --Joshmaul (talk) 18:06, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
With WotLK fansite giveaway keys came after the fansite "staff" keys so it will probably work the same way it did then. --PcjGamepedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!

C58,976 contributions and counting) 18:19, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

Aye, I'll enquire about a selection of other keys soon, cause 'admin' isn't really a strong delineation. Kirkburn  talk  contr 21:51, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
True, I'm not an editor. OTOH, I tried the Special:Contact link and was told (paraphrased) "this is just the general mailbox; I have no idea what you're on about." --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 21:53, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

Woah, I put the wrong link, I meant Special:EmailUser/Kirkburn me! Eirik, A'noob, I'll get back to you in the morning :) Tim passed on your emails. Kirkburn  talk  contr 22:20, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

Update for your questions: there's no specific limit on keys, just that it is 'reasonable' and that it is for 'staff'. For the moment I'm going with staff = admin. A'Noob, when the RFA is decided we can sort yours out :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 08:44, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
/bang on the door
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 13:38, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
Ah, good. We've been waiting for you.
/hands over a bag of oats and points at Old Blanchy
--Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 21:36, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
Blanchy is dead, Eirik. --Joshmaul (talk) 05:35, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 07:10, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
Does the "random distribution system" really work? ^^
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 18:17, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Still working on getting A'noob his key :( Aside: Nethaera did send over a general fansite reminder not to post datamined content - something I don't think we're guilty of, but letting y'all know anyway :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 21:07, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
Hmm... I didn't know you could request someone for Cataclysm Beta. Hallowseve15 (talk) 22:29, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
Currently, only admins can. This may or may not change down the line. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 22:33, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
Aww man, i really want a Beta Invite, especially since i got hack that was fake invite. Hallowseve15 (talk) 22:36, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
Gotta be careful, tons of warning posts are posted everywhere.
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 22:55, August 24, 2010 (UTC)

I'll love you forever if you get keys for editors with good track records :D Saberd of The Shattered Sun (talk) 23:09, August 24, 2010 (UTC)

Well, according to Kirkburn Blizzard stipulated that the number of keys given out should be "reasonable" and "for staff," so his hands may be tied on the matter. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 23:11, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
Like Dark T Zeratul, beta keys are at the moment only given out to admins. But I'm not sure what you mean with "good track records". (looks at edit counts) --User:Gourra/Sig2 09:04, August 25, 2010 (UTC)
Most likely "high count editors"
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 09:10, August 25, 2010 (UTC)
I'm spending the time a Beta key might tempt me away from by going quietly insane. Not that you can actually tell the difference, of course... So no, don't really feel the urgency to pester people about one. A few more [Pristine Black Diamonds], a few more Strat runs, and it'll all be about the herb grinding. /mumbles to self --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 23:44, August 31, 2010 (UTC)
I dun need no stinkin' title to tell people I'm insane. I just say "Hi, I'm Josh, I'm insane." See how easy that is? :) --Joshmaul (talk) 23:09, September 2, 2010 (UTC)
Ya, you're just sayin' that. You only THINK you're crazy. (You'd have to be nuts to think that, but that's a different story...) Me, people will know I'm insane without my even saying anything! --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 17:32, September 8, 2010 (UTC)
All science trembles at the searing logic of your fiery intellect. --Joshmaul (talk) 20:53, September 13, 2010 (UTC)
As is only proper. I'll show them. I'll show them ALL! Mwahahaha! --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 17:43, September 14, 2010 (UTC)
What was the topic of this forum already?
IconSmall Hamuul Loremaster A'noob, Arch Druid of the Noobhoof Clan (talk/contribz) 18:00, September 14, 2010 (UTC)
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